Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 31 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (12:03) * 1 lines
Some street celebrations in Palestine.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 32 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (12:08) * 81 lines
I got through to MSNBC. Definitely not new, but here's what they are
saying:
NEW YORK, Sept. 11 — Americans reeled in horror Tuesday as the worst
terrorist attack in U.S. history sent planes crashing into the World
Trade Center in New York, toppling the twin 110-story towers. An
explosion later rocked the Pentagon in Washington. The White House, the
Pentagon and the Capitol building were evacuated. Military jets
patrolled the skies above both cities. The FAA grounded all civilian
aircraft nationwide, but not before reports of another large aircraft
crashing in Western Pennsylvania. President Bush vowed to “hunt down
the folks who committed this act.”
THE FATE OF those in the twin skyscrapers was not immediately
known. Authorities had been trying to evacuate the thousands of people
who work in the twin towers, but many were thought to be trapped. “I
swear I’ve never seen anything like this,” said MSNBC’s Ashleigh
Banfield. “This whole place is like a complete war zone.”
At the Pentagon, eyewitnesses saw an aircraft crash into part
of the sprawling complex. Walls were later seen to have collapsed.
An earlier report of a car bomb exploding outside the State
Department was later denied.
In New York, the aircraft struck minutes apart, starting fires
and sending smoke billowing out of the skyscrapers. The top of the
south tower later collapsed onto the street below.
The first crash happened shortly before 9 a.m. ET.
MSNBC.com reporter Martin Wolk, who was inside one of the
towers, said the lights flickered and then a loud bang was heard.
People panicked and started to flee the building.
When they reached the lobby, smoke started to fill the building
and people could see debris falling and many cars outside were
damaged. “It was sheer pandemonium, people were screaming and crying,
afraid to go outside because of the falling debris,” Wolk said. “We
looked up and it looked like the top 20 floors were in flames.”
Another bystander described a barrage of debris raining down on
the sidewalk below.
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Shortly after 9 a.m., a second aircraft was seen crashing
into the other tower. Broadcast cameras already watching the scene
filmed the second plane as it slammed into the tower and exploded in a
huge fireball.
A half hour later, President Bush made a brief statement to
reporters, calling the disaster a “national tragedy” and attributing it
to terrorists. He did not cite any specific terrorist groups but vowed
to “hunt down the folks who committed this act.”
U.S. military jets reportedly took to the skies to shoot down
any unidentified aircraft, and congressional leaders were taken to
secure locations. A plane was reported to have been circling the
Capitol building before the evacuation.
American Airlines later acknowledged that one of its flights
had been hijacked Tuesday morning shortly after leaving Boston en route
to Los Angeles.
In the wake of the crashes, New York airports and the Lincoln
Tunnel were closed as precautionary measures. The stock exchanges in
New York also did not open.
Large holes were visible in sides of the 110-story buildings.
The tops of the twin towers were obscured by the smoke.
Thousands of pieces of what appeared to be office paper came
drifting over Brooklyn, about three miles from the tower, one witness
said.
Click on the image for reports of the terrorism attacks.
In an earlier terrorist attack, the center was bombed on Feb.
26, 1993, killing six people and injured more than 1,000 others.
Terrorist Ramzi Yousef and three others were convicted of orchestrating
the attack. Three other indicted co-conspirators remain at large.
Traffic entering New York City from New Jersey was at a
standstill approaching the Holland Tunnel as motorists stood outside
their cars watching the fire.
Across the country, highrises like Chicago’s Sears Trade tower
were being evacuated as a precaution. Buildings were also being
evacuated in London.
The Associated Press contributed to this report.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 33 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (12:11) * 89 lines
Terror attacks paralyze Washington, New York
By Shelley Emling and Marilyn Geewax
Cox News Service
Tuesday, September 11, 2001
WASHINGTON — An apparently coordinated series of terror attacks struck the
nation's capital and its largest city this morning, destroying both towers
of the World Trade Center in New York and shutting down most government
operations.
An airliner struck the north tower of the 110-story World Trade Center
about 8:45 a.m. EDT, followed about 18 minutes later by a second
apparently deliberate crash into the south tower. A little more than hour
later, the south tower collapsed, and the north tower folowed it.
In the capital, a fire forced the evacuation of the Pentagon, reportedly
after another aircraft struck the building. A car bomb explosion and fire
was also reported at the State Department, which was evacuated along with
the Capitol and the White House.
The Federal Aviation Administration suspended all aircraft takeoffs across
the country.
It was not immediately clear who was responsible for the attacks.
According to unconfirmed reports, a Palestinian group has claimed
responsibility for at least one of the attacks.
"There will be hell to pay in the weeks and months ahead," said Neil
Livingstone, a terrorism expert in Washington. "This basically amounts to
a declaration of war."
President Bush, visiting an elementary school in Sarasota, Fla., said,
"I've ordered that the full resources of the federal government go to help
the victims and their families and to conduct a full-scale investigation
to hunt down and to find those folks who committed this act. Terrorism
against our nation will not stand."
The sound of sirens on Capitol Hill added to the tension as vehicles
headed to emergencies in the city. Downtown streets were gridlocked as an
air of panic began to spread among workers who poured from buildings.
Smoke billowed from the Pentagon, just across the Potomac River from the
District of Columbia.
"I saw the tail of a large airliner. . . . It plowed right into the
Pentagon," said an Associated Press Radio reporter. "There is billowing
black smoke."
Shortly after the Capitol building was evacuated, Sen. John Kerry,
D-Mass., said there was an "unauthorized plane" in airspace in the
Washington area.
"People are trying to figure out where it is. That's all I can tell you
right now," Kerry said.
In New York, black smoke poured from the international landmark, and paper
and debris rained onto the streets.
By 9 a.m., thousands of people already were at work on the upper floors of
the World Trade Center. Casualties were impossible to determine
immediately, but were likely to number at least in the hundreds.
Ira Furman, a former spokesman for the National Transportation Safety
Board, said it was unlikely the acts were caused by pilot or navigational
error.
"It is beyond belief," he said. "Planes can come within a few miles of the
World Trade Center, but a pilot would never come this close."
One witness, Mary Cozza, said she heard a loud "boom" before seeing the
crash.
"I looked up and saw a plane that looked like it was flying too low," she
said. "It looked like it was aimed right at the World Trade Center. We saw
the crash. Shattered glass was pouring down. It didn't look like a giant
airliner. It didn't look like it was swerving out of control or anything."
The World Trade Center has been the target of terrorism before. In
February 1993 a terrorist bomb rocked the Manhattan skyscrapers.
The World Trade Center is one of the nation's most well-known structures
located in the heart of the U.S. financial district, one of the city's
most heavily populated areas. Many major financial and technology
companies are housed here and it's only a 10-minute walk from the U.S.
Stock Exchange. The stock exchange suspended trading just after the crash.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 34 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (12:17) * 10 lines
cnn.com (hard to get to now):
AMERICA UNDER ATTACK World Trade Centers collapse after planes hit, 10,000
emergency workers head to scene Plane hits Pentagon, part of the Pentagon
collapses American, United both confirm losing two planes each Bush calls
trade center crashes terrorist act Federal buildings, United Nations
evacuated FAA grounds all U.S. flights, sends trans-Atlantic flights to
Canada Israel evacuates embassies U.S.-Mexico border closed Non-essential
NATO employees asked to leave Brussels HQ
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 35 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (12:18) * 66 lines
NEW YORK (CNN) --
Terrorists struck the United States Tuesday morning in harrowing,
widespread attacks that included at least three commercial jet crashes
into significant buildings.
• In the first attack, a plane hit the north tower of the World Trade
Center in Manhattan shortly before 9 a.m., followed by another plane into
the second tower about 20 minutes later. Both towers later collapsed.
• About an hour later, a plane crashed into the Pentagon, part of which
later collapsed.
• American Airlines told CNN that it lost two planes in "tragic
accidents:" Flight 11 from Boston with 81 passengers and 11 crew aboard
and Flight 77 from Washington Dulles airport with 58 passengers and six
crew aboard. Both planes were en route to Los Angeles
• United Airlines Flight 93 airliner headed from Newark, New Jersey, to
San Francisco, crashed near Somerset, Pennsylvania -- police said initial
reports indicated no survivors. United also confirmed the crash of Flight
175 from Boston to Los Angeles.
• The Pentagon, the White House, the State Department, the Justice
Department, the Capitol, the CIA and all other government buildings in
Washington evacuated.
• President Bush cancelled an appearance in Florida to return to
Washington, calling the crashes "apparent terrorist attacks" and "a
national tragedy."
• In the first ever national ground stop of aircraft, all flights
nationwide have been stopped at their departure airports.
• All international flights were diverted to Canada.
• Mullah Abdul Salam Zaeef, the Taliban ambassador to Pakistan, said in
reaction to the news of the terror attacks that "we want to tell the
American children that Afghanistan feels your pain and we hope that the
courts find justice."
• In New York, more than 10,000 rescue personnel rushed to the scene. The
entire downtown area of Manhattan was evacuated as far north as
Rockefeller Center, according to an official at an emergency command post.
• Israel has evacuated all its missions around the world.
• The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention in Atlanta was evacuated.
CDC was preparing bioterrorism teams in case they become necessary.
• Philadelphia landmarks were also evacuated.
• In Chicago, the Sears Tower was evacuated; United Nations in New York
evacuated.
• The New York Port Authority said it had closed all bridges and tunnels
into the city.
• U.S. stock markets were closed after the New York attacks.
• NATO sent home all non-essential personnel from its Brussels, Belgium,
headquarters.
• Border between the United States and Mexico closed.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 36 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (12:25) * 45 lines
Nation: United plane crashes near Pittsburgh; 3 other flights missing
The Associated Press
PITTSBURGH (September 11, 2001 11:59 a.m. EDT) - A United Airlines plane crashed Tuesday morning just north of the Somerset County Airport. United said it was also "deeply concerned" about another plane, Flight 175, a Boeing 767, which was bound from Boston to Los Angeles.
American Airlines said Tuesday it had lost two planes with a total 156
people aboard, Agence-France Presse reported.
The United Boeing 757 was enroute from Newark, N.J. to San Francisco.
The United plane crashed about 10 a.m. about 8 miles east of Jennerstown,
according to county 911 dispatchers, WPXI-TV in Pittsburgh reported.
"It shook the whole station," said Bruce Grine, owner of Grine's Service
Center in Shanksville, about two and one-half miles from the crash.
"Everybody ran outside, and by that time the fire whistle was blowing."
United identified the plane as Flight 93. The airline did say how many
people were aboard the flight.
On behalf of the airline CEO James Goodwin said: "The thoughts of everyone
at United are with the passengers and crew of these flights. Our prayers
are also with everyone on the ground who may have been involved.
"United is working with all the relevant authorities, including the FBI,
to obtain further information on these flights," he said.
The Somerset County airport, about 80 miles southeast of Pittsburgh, in a
small, rural facility that does not handle such aircraft.
Because of the attacks, the Federal Aviation Administration had ordered
all departing flights canceled nationwide, and any planes already in the
air were to land a the nearest airport. The plane crashed shortly after
the order was issued.
The crash came the same morning that terrorists crashed two planes into
the World Trade Center in New York City and the twin 110-story towers
collapsed. A plane also hit the Pentagon in Washington
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 37 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (12:26) * 69 lines
By BETH GARDINER, Associated Press
LONDON (September 11, 2001 12:02 p.m. EDT) - Terrorist strikes in the
United States quickly reached a global audience Tuesday, with leaders
around the world watching live coverage of an aircraft hitting the World
Trade Center.
Audiences were transfixed by the awful images from New York, where both
World Trade Center towers collapsed.
Key indexes sank on world stock markets and some European airlines
canceled flights to the United States and recalled planes already in the
air.
Russian President Vladimir Putin expressed his condolences to the American
people over the terrorist attacks, calling the "terrible tragedies," the
Kremlin press service said.
"This mass terrorism is the new evil in our world today," said Prime
Minister Tony Blair, who canceled a speech at a trade union conference.
"It is perpetrated by fanatics who are utterly indifferent to the sanctity
of human life, and we the democracies of this world are going to have to
come together and fight it together."
President Jacques Chirac of France, in a nationally televised statement,
called the attacks in the United States "monstrous" and expressed his
solidarity with the American people.
"France has just learned of these monstrous attacks, there is no other
word for it, that have hit America," Chirac said from Rennes, in the
western region of Brittany.
Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat and his top aides followed the events at
his seaside office in Gaza City, gathered around a TV set.
"I send my condolences to the president, the government and the people for
this terrible incident," Arafat said. "We are completely shocked. It's
unbelievable."
In Berlin, Foreign Ministry officials huddled in a crisis meeting, and
Parliament's vice speaker Anke Fuchs told lawmakers a "terrible
catastrophe" had happened.
Virtually all German TV channels switched to live coverage. "This is pure
mass murder," one commentator said.
Scandinavian Airlines System, SAS, rerouted three airplanes bound for New
York and one for Washington from Norway, Denmark and Sweden.
Flights to the United States were suspended from Portugal, and the Belgian
airline recalled two flights on the way to the United States, diverted
others to Canada and canceled all planned flights to the United States.
In Thailand, Suranand Vejjajiva, a spokesman for the office of Prime
Minister Thaksin Shinawatra said they were watching the news in disbelief.
A spokesman for Philippine President Gloria Macapagal Arroyo said: "The
president has been monitoring the events since an hour ago and she
condemns what is obviously the worst terrorist attack on a leader of
civilized society."
Broadcasters around the world broke into programming to show images of the
disaster.
"It's incredible. I thought I was watching a Hollywood movie," said Hong
Kong school teacher Doris Tang.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 38 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (12:27) * 13 lines
Agence France-Presse
MOSCOW (September 11, 2001 12:15 p.m. EDT) - Russian President Vladimir
Putin told President Bush on Tuesday that the terrorist attacks on New
York and Washington "must not go unpunished", the Interfax news agency
reported.
"The series of barbaric acts directed against innocent people fills us
with indignation and revolt," said Putin in a telegram to Bush.
"Such inhuman acts must not go unpunished," he said.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 39 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (12:30) * 51 lines
(September 11, 2001 11:18 a.m. EDT) - Timeline of U.S. Attacks
- Plane crashes into tower of World Trade Center in lower Manhattan,
shortly before 9 a.m. Eastern.
- Second plane crashes into the second tower of the World Trade Center,
shortly after 9 a.m. Eastern.
- President Bush, in Sarasota, Florida, calls the crashes "an apparent
terrorist attack" and a "national tragedy."
- An aircraft crashes near Pentagon, just outside of Washington D-C, in
Northern Virginia, about an hour after the attacks in New York.
- Government buildings in Washington, including the Capitol and the White
House, are evacuated with officials citing a credible threat of a
terrorist attack.
- The Federal Aviation Administration shuts down all aircraft takeoffs
nationwide.
- Shortly after 10 a.m. Eastern, one World Trade Center tower in New York
collapses, about an hour after being hit by plane.
- American Airlines says one of the planes that crashed into the Trade
Center was American Airlines Flight 11, hijacked after takeoff from Boston
en route to Los Angeles.
- Senior law enforcement officials say car bomb explodes outside of State
Department in Washington, D-C. Federal protective services later denies
car bomb attack occurred.
- Financial markets suspend trading in the wake of the attacks.
- Officials at Somerset County Airport say a large plane crashes in
western Pennsylvania, about 80 miles southeast of Pittsburgh, at about
10:00 a.m.
- The second tower of the World Trade Center collapses at 10:28 a.m.
Eastern.
- Fourth explosion rocks the collapsed remains of the World Trade Center,
at about 10:38 a.m.
- Authorities across the country go on alert, tightening security at
strategic facilities and evacuating high-profile buildings. U.S. monuments
and museums in Washington DC are closed.
- Securities and Exchange Commission says all financial markets are closed
for the day.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 40 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (12:50) * 3 lines
Dan Rather reports Bush is going to make a statement from an Air Force Base
in Louisiana in a few minutes.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 41 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (12:51) * 15 lines
All 4 flights that crashed were apparently bound for California. When did
the airlines first realize that something was wrong? The plane from Boston
that crashed into the WTC was bound for Los Angeles.
Topic 1180 [current]: Terrorist attack on the World Trade Center
#199 of 199: Jerry (jmcarlin) Tue Sep 11 '01 (09:47) 6 lines
CNN says 4 plans lost/missing: 2 American and 2 united. They said
that they *think* that one of them might be one that hit the
Pentagon.
CNN is also reporting that bin Laden is increasingly being blamed.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 42 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (12:51) * 7 lines
Salon confirms military is at Delta.
http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2001/09/11/bombings/index.html
There is no higher military alert than Delta.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 43 of 803: Liz K (ekelley) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (13:04) * 8 lines
I'm on Long Island, 40 miles east of the city...was at work when this
happened. several of my friends work in NYC, one of them in 7 World
Trade, a building next to tower 2. i'm so scared right now... how could
anyone do something like this?! 10K people work(ed) in each of those
towers, not counting the tourists, people on the streets, etc. i feel
sick.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 44 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (13:09) * 1 lines
I hope your friends are ok Liz.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 45 of 803: Charlotte Bridges (Charlotte) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (13:10) * 8 lines
People have been comparing this to Pearl Harbor. Most of us were not born
at the time of that event. The feeling today's events conjures in me is
the fear I lived through in 1962 during the Cuban missile crisis. At that
time, only one man stood between us and WWIII. If we could trace these
attacks to one country, we would now be at war. And I doubt that even JFK
could prevent it.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 46 of 803: Charlotte Bridges (Charlotte) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (13:11) * 1 lines
Incidentally, 45-50 thousand people work in the two WTC buildings...not 10K.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 47 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (13:18) * 8 lines
unidentified source:
Friend of mine in Scotland, who is monitoring a lot of news feeds and has a
bunch of friends in US military bases, is giving me info that I can't find
_anywhere_ else- he claims that 12 (!) planes are still en route to the US,
not all over the Atlantic, and that are not responding to hails.
Anyone know anything about this?
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 48 of 803: Charlotte Bridges (Charlotte) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (13:19) * 1 lines
Incidentally, 45-50 thousand people work in the two WTC buildings...not 10K.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 49 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (13:21) * 4 lines
I think I heard somewhere that 55,000 or so were killed in the Vietnam
war, the toll here is going to be horrorific.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 50 of 803: Liz K (ekelley) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (13:26) * 8 lines
yes, charlotte..what I meant was 10K per tower in just the offices,
minimum capacity. full capacity is closer to 20-25K per tower. it
doesn't matter the toll; one life is too much.
thanks, terry. I'm praying for all who have friends or relatives in
downtown.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 51 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (13:40) * 6 lines
Colin Powell said:
"A great tragedy has struck our country and it will not affect the
nature of our society,'' he said. ``We'll find out who's responsible
for this and bring them to justice.''
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 52 of 803: Charlotte (Charlotte) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (13:48) * 7 lines
Agreed, Liz. Sorry I misunderstood. Also sorry my post appeared twice.
Must have been cause I "refresh"-ed.
Terry, thank you for making this site available when it is impossible to
get news elsewhere.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 53 of 803: Maggie (sociolingo) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (14:00) * 15 lines
Yes, Terry, thanks for the email about the topic ..I'm in the UK, we
turned on the TV just after the first plane hit and have been following
the news since. Our prayers and thoughts are with all those concerned and
I hope that my friends on Spring get good news about people they know.
In the City of London the Stock Exchange closed, and several major
buildings were evacuated and the City closed. All US banks and
institutions here are on high alert.
There were reports an hour or so ago about another plane crash in
Pittsburg which appeared to be related. Also a report of another hijack
plane heading for Washington ..... sorry I don't have any details
...anyone else have any news??
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 54 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (14:03) * 10 lines
In Hawaii, on the Bis Island, all schools are closed as is the airport
(throughout the state, actually). On Oahu, all military personnel are to
report to their stations, Pearl Harbor all ships staffed. Arizona
Memorial closed.
This is ghastly. Beyond anything Hollywood could dream up. Be calm, stay
home, donate blood if you can, (even call for it here) and PRAY. Thanks
Terry!
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 55 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (14:03) * 144 lines
There's news of this above in this topic.
The other hijacked plane went down, it was the same plane that went down
in Pittsburgh.
“I JUST SAW the building I work in come down,” said businessman
Gabriel Ioan, shaking in shock outside City Hall a cloud of smoke and ash
from the World Trade Center behind him. “I just saw the top of Trade Two
come down.”
MSNBC.com producer Steve Johnson, standing about six blocks from
the towers in lower Manhattan, was also an eyewitness to the collapse.
“About five minutes before the tower fell you could see people jumping
from the upper floors. I watched six either fall or jump ... The police
rolled up [in] vans. Suddenly the top of [the tower] just shattered into
tens of thousands of pieces. You could see the walls peel away. The whole
thing just disappeared. Then the smoke came up. The cops started yelling,
“Get back! Run! Get away!” I ran inside a hotel, and it went black outside
because of the dust.”
Nearby a crowd mobbed a man on a pay phone, screaming at him to get
off the phone so that they could call relatives. Dust and dirt flew
everywhere. Ash was 2 to 3 inches deep in places. People wandered dazed
and terrified.
“I was in the World Financial Center looking out the window,” said
one woman. “I saw the first plane and then 15 minutes later saw the other
plane just slam into the World Trade Center.”
Firefighter Jimmy Grillo, with Ladder 24, had blood running down
his face from an injury to his nose. Grillo was in the lobby of the World
Trade Center after the first blast and when the second blast came, he was
trapped in the debris. “We crawled in the debris toward the light….
There’s a bunch of guys still trapped in there,” Grillo told MSNBC.com’s
Johnson.
‘PEOPLE SCREAMING ... DIVING FOR COVER’
Another eyewitness, AP newsman Dunstan Prial, described a strange
sucking sound from the Trade Center buildings after the first building
collapsed.
“Windows shattered. People were screaming and diving for cover.
People walked around like ghosts, covered in dirt, weeping and wandering
dazed.”
“It sounded like a jet or rocket,” said Eddie Gonzalez, a postal
worker at a post office on West Broadway. “I looked up and saw a huge
explosion. I didn’t see the impact. I just saw the explosion.”
Morning commuters heading into Manhattan were stranded as the
Lincoln Tunnel was shut down to incoming traffic. Many left their cars and
stood on the ramp leading to the tunnel, staring in disbelief at the thick
cloud of smoke pouring from the top of the two buildings.
On the streets of Manhattan, people stood in groups talking quietly
or watching on television at ground-level network studios.
Terror attack on the U.S.
• Main story
• MSNBC's Wolk: On the scene in Manhattan
• Witnesses describe terror in the towers
• World reacts with horror
• Markets, airports, U.S. border shut after terror
• Newsweek: An icon destroyed
• Exodus in Washington
• Live video coverage
• Discuss the attacks on MSNBC's bulletin board
Joan Goldstein, communications project leader for The Associated
Press, was on a bus from New Jersey at about 8:50 a.m. when she saw “smoke
pouring out of the World Trade Center building. We said, ‘Oh, my God! The
World Trade Center’s on fire!”
Perhaps 10 minutes later, “All of a sudden, there was an orange
plume, a huge explosion. It shot out the back of the building. Everybody
on the bus was just moaning and gasping,” said Goldstein, who wept and
trembled as she spoke.
The plume was from the second plane, but she didn’t see the plane
because of the thick smoke.
She tried to call friends who work there, but couldn’t get through.
“It was the most horrible thing I’ve ever seen in my life,” said
Goldstein.
GIVING BLOOD
At St. Vincent’s hospital in Greenwich Village, people waited in
long lines to give blood. They were taken according to blood type.
Hundreds of donors — perhaps as many as a thousand — looked like a
tapestry of New York citizenry.
“There are all kinds of people — young and old, black and white,
students and professionals waiting to give blood,” said Harry Barandes, a
graduate student at New York University.
Ambulances continued to arrive intermittently. The shock on
people’s faces was shaken free only by the sirens that blared in the
background. Meanwhile, volunteers wandered among those waiting in line,
asking if anyone was hungry or thirsty.
“There are really kind citizens passing out food and water,” said
Barandes. “The outpouring of goodwill is amazing.”
Further from the disaster scene in upper Manhattan signs went up
that blood drives had begun.
SURREAL SCENE, EERY CALM
‘There’s a huge smell of char in the air. People are walking with masks,
with their shirts off. People trying to get out [of the area] any way.
People are crying, watching in disbelief. [It’s] total shock.’ — MICHELLE
PRELI MSNBC.com producer In Brooklyn, across the East River from
Manhattan, “the situation is chaos,” MSNBC.com producer Michelle Preli
reported. “The Manhattan Bridge and Brooklyn Bridge are just full of
people covered in white ash. There’s a huge smell of char in the air.
People are walking with masks, with their shirts off. People trying to get
out [of the area] any way. People are crying, watching in disbelief.
[It’s] total shock. It seems all the medical units, ambulances fire
services from Brooklyn [have been called in].”
Although the city itself is in shock, it hasn’t really reached
uptown Manhattan yet. On the Upper West Side, where you could see police
helicopters standing in the sky like sentinels along the Hudson River, it
is all eerily calm.
“There are people eating in the restaurants,” said Andras Szanto, a
staff member at Columbia University. “It is a glorious sunny day — after a
rainstorm of biblical proportions last night — and this perfect fall day
makes it even more surreal.
“At first sight everything seems normal,” Szanto continued. “Then
you notice strangers hudddled around radios, students gazing at TVs in the
cafes, lines at the bank for cash.”
A sign on a Starbucks coffee shop says, “Due to the terrorist
attack we are closed today.”
“A homeless man is reciting the list of the day’s unspeakable
horrors,” said Szanto. “There are small strange differences that translate
the larger horror into minute changes: For the first time, for example,
the majestic gates [protecting the campus] of Columbia University have
been closed shut.”
CROWDS STREAMING ON FOOT
‘The mass of the city, this huge population, had to get out of the city
and they seemed to be doing it very matter of factly.’ — PRELI
Five hour after the towers collapsed people were still streaming
on foot across all levels of the Manhattan Bridge as they left the
disaster area.
“What was most amazing was how calm people were,” said MSNBC.com’s
Preli, who had been in her car just blocks from the disaster as splinters
of debris rained down looking oddly like confetti.
“Maybe everyone was just in shock. But the mass of the city, this
huge population, had to get out of the city and they seemed to be doing it
very matter of factly.”
The Associated Press contributed to this report.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 56 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (14:03) * 1 lines
German stock exchange threatened by bomb attack. They are closing.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 57 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (14:04) * 3 lines
“THERE HAVE BEEN the most terrible, shocking events taking place in the United States of America within the last couple of hours,”
British Prime Minister Tony Blair told union leaders in Brighton, southern England. “We can only imagine the terror and carnage there and the many, many innocent people who have lost their lives.”
Blair, who had been due to deliver a key policy speech, cut short his visit and said he wanted to return immediately to London to monitor the unfolding events. He sent his deepest condolences to Bush and the people of America.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 58 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (14:05) * 43 lines
“This mass terrorism is the new evil in our world today. It is
perpetrated by fanatics who are utterly indifferent to the sanctity of
life,” he said.
Russian President Vladimir Putin described the attack as a terrible
tragedy, according to Kremlin spokesman Alexei Gromov, and convened a
special meeting of his defense and security officials. Putin also offered
his condolence to the United States.
France’s president, Jacques Chirac, in a live televised address,
condemned the attacks and expressed his solidarity with the American
people.
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“France has just learned of these monstrous attacks — there is no
other word for it — that have hit America,” Chirac said from Rennes, in
the western region of Brittany.
In Berlin, Foreign Ministry officials huddled in a crisis meeting,
and Parliament’s vice speaker, Anke Fuchs, told lawmakers a “terrible
catastrophe” had happened.
Virtually all German TV channels switched to live coverage. “This
is pure mass murder,” one commentator said.
German Chancellor Gerhard Schroeder convened an unprecedented
meeting of his security council, and air traffic authorities said all
European flights to the United States had been suspended.
The council meets rarely and is the government’s main body in times
of crisis. Besides Schroeder, it includes the foreign, defense and
interior ministers and several others.
MIDEAST REACTS
Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat and his top aides followed the
events at his seaside office in Gaza City, gathered around a TV set.
“We completely condemn this serious operation. ... We were
completely shocked. It’s unbelievable, unbelievable, unbelievable.”
An anonymous caller told Abu Dhabi television earlier on Tuesday
that a radical Palestinian group was responsible for the attacks, but the
group later denied any involvement.
Israeli Defense Minister Binyamin Ben-Eliezer told Israel’s Army
Radio it was “simply a tragedy.”
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 59 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (14:06) * 10 lines
The Pittsburgh plane crash is the one they believe was also headed for
Washington DC, with some speculating that it might have either the Capitol
(building) or White House as its target. How they could come to that, I'll
never know. Two planes were targeted at the WTC (one at each tower). The
Pentagon is an enormous building (sq ft-wise).
All the planes (4) had California as their destination which would give
them the maximum amount of fuel any aircraft would have onboard.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 60 of 803: Eliz (loveliz) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (14:11) * 13 lines
Hi, just heard that a passenger from the PA crash had a cell phone in the
bathroom and reported that they were being hijacked..."this is not a
hoax". guess not.
Also heard that there were 6-8 planes in the air that would be allowed to
land at the Nashville airport.
My daughter's fiance's sister is an intern at St. Vincents. She is alive.
Just heard that there were over 100 victims there, 2 dead, but I had heard
earlier that the vestibule was stacked with fatal burn victims. Hope that
was a rumor. love,Eliz
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 61 of 803: Tobias Schaefer (ToSch) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (14:11) * 9 lines
All the German and European people want to express their condolence to the
people of the United States!
Our prayers are with the victims and their families!
God bless you!
Your Tobias
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 62 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (14:23) * 10 lines
From the eyewitness reports on the BBC it appears that the second
plane flew slowly and directly into the south tower of the WTC. Its
likely that the terrorists flew the planes.
CNN is talking about the lead time that air traffic controllers had that
the planes were off course. One made a sharp turn at Albany and headed
south. They are also talking about the tapes of the controllers trying to
talk to the planes. Just speculation right now - the tapes are not yet
available.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 63 of 803: BlackB (BlackB) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (14:24) * 8 lines
My thoughts and prayers are with those whose families are affected by
these tragedies. All German TV channels do reports now. Something however
disturbs me in some way: in the first chapter of Tom Clancy's novel
"Executive Orders" a plane crashes into the capitol and kills everyone
inside. Seems like the wrong people read that book....
BlackB
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 64 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (14:27) * 63 lines
BlackB, I've had the same thoughts about giving the truly warped mentally
bad ideas for their terrorism in books and movies.
FCC, federal agencies shut down after terrorist attacks
Along with most other federal agencies, the FCC has closed its
offices and sent its employees home in the wake of apparent
terrorist attacks this morning in New York City, Washington, DC, and
elsewhere. The FCC has issued no emergency declaration nor other
special instructions to the Amateur Radio community. The ARRL has
advised amateurs to stay alert to instructions from local
authorities. President George W. Bush has announced that the US
military is on high alert in the US and abroad.
US air traffic was shut down after two airliners struck the twin
towers of the 110-story World Trade Center in New York City this
morning within a short time of each other. The building's towers
partially collapsed in the wake of the collisions. An aircraft
subsequently crashed into the Pentagon, and another aircraft crashed
near Pittsburgh, reportedly after being hijacked. American Airlines
and United Airlines both have acknowledged that they have lost
planes this morning. More than 260 died in the crashes. Thousands
were believed injured in New York City; there's no estimate on the
number killed.
New York City-Long Island Section Emergency Coordinator Tom
Carrubba, KA2D, said there has been no request for any Amateur Radio
Emergency Service response at this time, although hams have been
requested to assist the American Red Cross. New York City's
emergency management offices are located in the World Trade Center.
He said he was alerting all amateurs, especially ARES and Radio
Amateur Civil Emergency Service personnel, to get prepared and to
stand by. Carrubba said he's in the process of setting up a command
channel on a linked repeater system that will cover the area from
New York City into Long Island's Suffolk County. Kenneth Goetz,
N2SQW, reports New York State RACES is operational on 3.993.5 and
7.248 MHz handling emergency and governmental-type traffic. He asked
amateurs to avoid these frequencies.
In the Washington, DC, area, Virginia SEC Tom Gregory, N4NW, says
Virginia ARES has been put on alert but has not yet been activated.
''I've asked everyone to monitor the emergency frequencies and to
keep a full tank of gas.'' He said the attack on Washington has
resulted in a massive traffic jam as workers in DC attempt to leave
the capital; cellular telephone communication was
next-to-impossible. While no emergency nets are in operation yet,
Gregory said all repeaters would be available as well as 7.243 MHz
and 3.947 MHz on HF.
Virginia RACES reportedly has been activated at the state emergency
operations center at Virginia State Police headquarters in Richmond
as a precautionary measure.
The FCC's Riley Hollingsworth today suggested that the amateur
community remain calm but ready. He invited amateurs monitoring any
suspicious radio activity to contact him, and he will relay relevant
information to the FCC duty team. He advised monitors to tape such
radio traffic, if possible.
Should a state of war be declared, Amateur Radio would not
automatically be shut down. This requirement was eliminated prior to
the Gulf War.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 65 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (14:38) * 14 lines
first chapter of Tom Clancy's novel "Executive Orders"
The kamikaze plane attack on the Capitol Building was the plot of the book
before that one: Debt of Honor. The pilot was part of the plan, which took
out the entire government.
You don't need eyewitness reports on BBC. The second plane attacking the
WTC is on video on every news channel. You could probably have watched it
live, just as you could watch both towers crumble.
It is very likely the terrorists took over flying the planes as no US
pilot - even with a gun pointed at his/her head - would steer into any
occupied building.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 66 of 803: Rebecca Carson (Becka) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (14:53) * 12 lines
Karen: my Mom mentioned the book this morning. Ominous.
I cannot explain my grief and sadness. My thoughts are with all those
people, so, so many lives that are forever changed.
I can't get out of my head that some people actually saw the horrified
faces of those passengers in those hijacked planes - waiting to die in
vain.
And all those people who went to work and never came back.
God bless us all.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 67 of 803: Beth (Bethanne) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (15:04) * 12 lines
I'm in Atlanta. The area around CNN Center which is in downtown Atlanta,
has been sealed off and all public access to CNN Center itself has been
stopped. I guess as lots of the the world gets it global/US news coverage
news via CNN, it is a facility the authorities don't want messed with.
All malls, schools and universities here etc are closed.
At 3pm Eastern, 10-12 international flights are still in-bound to the US
and have been given clearance to land. They are all from the Pacific Rim
countries in bound to West Coast Cities.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 68 of 803: Beth (Bethanne) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (15:09) * 5 lines
President Bush just landed at Straegic Airforce Command in Nebraska. So
it appears the President and his advisors, are not going to orchestrate a
response to this catastrophe from the White House.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 69 of 803: Tobias Schaefer (ToSch) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (15:12) * 3 lines
German TV Broadcasting stopped for 15 Minutes!!!
" A moment of silence for our Brothers and Sisters in the USA!!!"
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 70 of 803: Beth (Bethanne) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (15:19) * 1 lines
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 71 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (15:41) * 6 lines
Inbound planes from the Orient are being allowd to land in Honolulu if
they have gone beyond the point of no return, but with a fighter escort
from Hickam AF Base. Nothing is outbound. Even the tour planes are
grounded. Nothing is in the air!
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 72 of 803: Laura T (LauraT) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (15:42) * 12 lines
More stuff about the cellphone call, from an AP News story:
"An emergency dispatcher in Westmoreland County, Pa., received a cell
phone call at 9:58 a.m. from a man who said he was a passenger locked in
the bathroom of United Flight 93, said dispatch supervisor Glenn Cramer.
"We are being hijacked, we are being hijacked!" Cramer quoted the man as
saying. The man told dispatchers the plane "was going down. He heard some
sort of explosion and saw white smoke coming from the plane and we lost
contact with him," Cramer said."
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 73 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (15:42) * 2 lines
So it appears the President and his advisors, are not going to orchestrate a response to this catastrophe from the White House.
No. The book on these types of situations calls for moving the president, et al, around to *secure* locations. Unfortunately, our wonderfully free press is publicizing all the known locations for government backup ops. Why don't they just give the addresses?
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 74 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (15:43) * 1 lines
The airports are closed until noon tomorrow BTW.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 75 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (15:47) * 1 lines
Thanks Tobias and all who have expressed condolences. Actually we are all one little world. We need to relearn the art of getting along on a tiny planet. This American appreciates your concern very much!
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 76 of 803: Laura (LauraMM) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (15:48) * 4 lines
Why don't they just give the addresses?
I know! Geez, here they are saying he's in a secret location, in NEBRASKA??? hello????
They evacuated all of Boston today. The one question I ask, that no one an answer is HOW THE HELL DID HIJACKERS GET PAST SECURITY AT LOGAN????????????? (Makes one wonder about the security personnel at the airport now?)
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 77 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (15:49) * 1 lines
Karen, exactly so. The set the plane down and suddenly we all knew exactly where he was! I hate that!!! The media needs to learn some responsibility!
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 78 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:06) * 19 lines
stratfor.com:
The Intelligence Failure
1745 GMT, 010911
By George Friedman
As of this moment, what is clear is that a substantial number of civilian aircraft were hijacked this morning by pilots with sufficient ability to maneuver those multi-engine aircraft into collisions with major buildings. The flights originated at a number of airports. Each incident required the presence of at least one and probably more hijackers, each prepared to die in the attack.
Mounting an attack of this sort is not simple. In the case of the World Trade Center, the collapse of the towers indicates massive delayed explosions. This means either the planes were loaded with explosives or that massive explosive charges were planted in the buildings to go off later. This is supposition, but a secondary explosion is a necessary factor for explaining the collapse.
This means many individuals had to be involved in the operation. There had to be a coordinated effort spanning several continents, timed to occur at roughly the same time. At best guess, dozens of people had to be involved. Messages had to flow, coded or otherwise. Yet no human intelligence sources appear to have been among or near the conspirators. No significant messages were intercepted or decoded.
For U.S. intelligence to have missed an operation of this magnitude indicates one of two things. First, the competence of U.S. intelligence is overrated or the willingness of policymakers to heed warnings has declined. In either case, the system is badly broken. Alternatively, the sophistication of terrorist counter-intelligence has improved to such an extent that the prior level of expertise bought to bear is simply no longer sufficient.
Whether we are facing a decline in U.S. intelligence capability or an increase in counter-intelligence blocking the United States, Sept. 11, 2001, will go down as one of the major intelligence failures in U.S. history.
George Friedman is the founder and chariman of STRATFOR.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 79 of 803: Laura T (LauraT) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:15) * 18 lines
From salon.com
Sam Skinner, former transportation secretary under George Bush Sr., directed a "security enhancement task force" after Pan-Am flight 103 was shot down in 1988 over Lockerbie, Scotland, killing 270 people.
I'm looking back on my experience after Pan Am flight 103. We created offices for security in several departments and we enhanced the methods at every airport, so I'm very, very surprised that they were able to accomplish this. The fact that they could get through three airports on four flights without anyone picking it up, shows that this was a very well-organized attack -- probably with some inside help.
We've concentrated most of our time and energy on international aircraft. We focused on that threat because they may have been coming in from international airports where security was lax, or going to international locations, in which it would be easier to hide people who would profile as terrorists.
So the fact that four domestic flights were hijacked is entirely shocking. I don't know of any scenario that allowed for this. This is not an amateur performance. It must have had support from strong organizations or governments.
You would have had to have at least four inside people, at airports with access to planes with full fuel loads. You'd have to have them plant weapons at the same moment without being detected. And I find it hard to believe that any American pilot would deliberately fly into the building, so I also have to assume that they managed to get an experienced pilot on board.
The timing of it is also amazing. All the planes were close to their targets but the crashes occurred at around the same time.
This was very well-executed, and as a result, security measures as we know them today will be enhanced substantially. What that will be is too early to tell. But there will a lot of money spent on devices; I also think there will a higher scrutiny of employees and of cargo. You can get pretty draconian, and I think we'll see that whole new level of scrutiny. This is different than what we've ever seen in the past. This isn't just blowing up airplanes, this is using airplanes as a tool of death.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 80 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:17) * 34 lines
Covering the Attack
An Eyewitness Speaks
By Ed Hashey
Special to Poynter.org
[Editor's note: Ed Hashey is a member of Poynter's visiting visual journalism faculty and an affiliate of Mario Garcia New Media Group.]
I keep playing this back in my head. It just did not seem real, nor would I ever have imagined such a series of events happening this morning. It is true: Everything seemed to be in slow motion.
I arrived here Sunday night with my wife. She was going to spend the whole week with me for my birthday. I reported to work yesterday as a consultant at The Wall Street Journal.
Monday we just came up with the work load for the next few weeks. I came back to the hotel at midtown Manhattan, had dinner with my wife, Jeanne, where we discussed our day's events and plans for tomorrow.
Jeanne said she want to come in with me to the downtown area on Tuesday morning and visit the top of the World Trade Center. She found a two-dollar discount coupon. The next morning we both ate breakfast and my wife decided she was not feeling well enough to join me this morning.
So I left for work this morning at 8 a.m. I got on the number 9 train from Times Square, and read a chapter in my book. Before you knew it, it was 8:40 a.m. and I was at the World Trade Center station at Cortland Street.
I got off the train, walked up to the street exit, and right as I saw daylight, I heard a huge explosion and then many pieces of metal debris, some the size of car hoods, were falling all around me and a very large crowd of people.
We all responded by trying to go back in the train station exit, but there were too many people trying to exit, and so we all squeezed against the side of the World Trade Center. After a while, the debris stopped falling. We crossed Liberty street, and looked up and saw the first tower engulfed in flames. Eyewitnesses said a plane had crashed into the building high up.
Then to my horror, I started seeing people jump to their deaths. As each person fell, I started praying. Many people fell, and we were not sure where to go or what to do. Then a loud noise of an aircraft became apparent, and I remember seeing a large airline jet smash into the next tower, followed by many flaming pieces falling all around us and many people being struck by debris and burning wreckage. I ran into an entryway of the building across the street and saw debris take out windows. A large crowd of pedestrians outside was hit as they were on their way to work.
At that point the police ordered a mass evacuation, and I remember thinking this was a terrorist act. It was just too coincidental too be anything else.
I decided to just start running north up Broadway. By the time I reached Chambers Street, I kept trying phones to call my wife and say I was OK, but nothing was working, all circuits busy, my cell phone did not work.
So I just got on a train and ran to my hotel room. My wife was in tears, and I was shaking like a leaf. I as still shaking and very sad, then I witnessed the towers falling on the news channel, and I just stood there in disbelief.
I am sad, angry, nervous, happy to be alive, but humbled by others' deaths today. I can't stop seeing the visions of bodies falling. I still pray for their families, but the world will never be the same again.
I'm very sorry to be writing this.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 81 of 803: rachael (rachael) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:18) * 3 lines
UK news is saying that the US President has gone to Nebraska because that's HQ when the USA is on a war footing.
To all my old friends in the US, and the new ones I've made here on Spring recently, my thoughts and prayers are with you on this dreadful day. Take care, all of you.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 82 of 803: winter (winter) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:27) * 9 lines
HOW THE HELL DID HIJACKERS GET PAST SECURITY AT LOGAN?????????????
Well, considering these were domestic flights, I suspect that security is a little more lax. I remember listening to an NPR story not too long ago about how airport security employees have such a high turn-around, and most aren't unionized....
I'm in LA where things are eerily quiet. Schools are still in session, but they've cancelled a lot of events tonight (the Madonna concert, Latin Grammys, MLB games, etc..). Some production studios (the major ones anyway) have also shut down for the day.
I'm trying to get work done, but it's just too difficult.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 83 of 803: Autumn (autumn) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:27) * 4 lines
Alas, Babylon...
Maryland has been declared a state of emergency. The military post S. works on is at its highest security level, there are massive amounts of agent stored there. Schools, colleges, programs, everything is closed. Hospitals have canceled all elective surgeries to stay ready for victims. I was in D.C. on Monday, sight-seeing with my aunt from Dallas. She tried to call us all afternoon, but there were no available circuits until 3:30. It is so quiet--there's not a car on the road (everyone's watching TV I guess) or a plane in the sky. Weird. I can't even process it all yet.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 84 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:28) * 113 lines
pastebomb alert -- bruces *8-(
that peculiar parade-going-in-the-wrong-direction has passed ... maybe
we'll find out what that was, at some point ...
people are now out of their offices for lunchtime, still almost no
traffic, but the shops are open and people are hanging out watching the
clouds of smoke ... the view towards the south is unimaginable ... much
more jet activity ...
-Ken
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NYC, Fifth Avenue & 19th St.
... people are walking in large crowds in the middle of Fifth Ave.,
heading south, as if in a parade. Many more have been standing, looking
south, for hours now, as if waiting for something else to happen. It's
just clouds of smoke now where the WTC used to be... Some people have
radios, portable tvs. Few people's cell phones are working. Apart from
the downed antennae, the circuits are just jammed, regular phones are
jammed, too. The only traffic seems to be ambulances. Apart from the
sirens, it is eerily quiet for midday ... fighter jets are flying
overhead now ...
-Ken
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another meaning for spectre....
Pandemonium envelops reporters incapable of expressing much more than shock.
The highways in lower Manhattan are loaded with an exodus of refugees
escaping downtown. Electricity has been shut don in lower Manhattan.
Airports are in chaos. Everything has a surreal siege status.
No official word other than a short statement from Bush early this morning.
His plane from Florida will not go to Washington where Chaney is "in charge"
at the White House.
more soon,
Tim
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i can just report, that here at ZKM in karlsruhe we are also totally
shocked, following the news on German tv and CNN for hours and don't
know really what to say as angst is emerging of the events. what will
happen now? will this event to exponentiate the use of terror between
south and north, between east and west?
most embarassing seems the clean, totally emotion-less face of G.W.
Bush. cannot believe that this is an eqiuvalent reaction of his. (is he
in drugs?)
best to all,
anke
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The national guard has been called up in NYC -- Its like a war zone, they
are
predicting the death toll as being in the thousands -- 40,000 people work in
the
two towers and were in the process of arriving for work when the first plane
struck -- I witnessed the collapse of the second tower, from a roof about a
half
mile away-- the city is shut down -- there are still three or 4 more planes
unaccounted for -- the pentagon was also attacked and severely damaged --
with
large lost of life-- a plane was brought down near camp David -- I placed
part
of the blame for this turn of events on the Bush administration's failure
to
intervene in Palestine, his failure to send observers and his failure to
condemn
Israel's policy of assination against Palestine leaders. This is truly a
horror.
Saul
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.
y
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 85 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:31) * 74 lines
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
bruce --
i'm putting together a piece for tomorrow's paper on how the internet
reacted/helped/hurt in the face of this disaster. i need help. if you see
or hear anything that would feed into this story, please let me know. if
you've got anything to say, please give me a quote. i am working out of my
home. 540 347 1960. garreau@well.com or garreauj@washpost.com. i'll need
to start writing 4-ish eastern time, although i can push later than that
for good stuff. please pass the word to anybody else who can help.
thanx.
joel
Joel Garreau
The Washington Post
202 334 6269 voice
202 334 5587 fax
garreauj@washpost.com
"But I keep hitting these typewriter keys. What a magician is the
subconscious. If only it would work regular hours."
-- Raymond Chandler, "The Long Goodbye"
21ST CENTURY DETERRENCE AND TODAY'S ATTACKS
Washington, D.C., September 11/PRNEWSWIRE/ -- Responding to today's
attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, Robert David Steele,
author of ON INTELLIGENCE: Spies and Secrecy in an Open World (AFCEA, 2000),
said: "The tragedy of today's coordinated attacks against the World Trade
Center and the Pentagon--with other targets expected shortly--must be
regarded as the Pearl Harbor of the 21st Century. Our national leaders have
wasted ten years since the end of the Cold War, failing to understand that
it is instability, poverty, oppression, disease, and cultural conflict that
require the USA to expend billions of dollars on stabilizing and nurturing
the Whole Earth."
Mr. Steele goes on to note, ""As Robert McNamara and others have pointed
out, 'at least two thirds of the world's people--Chinese, Russian, Indians,
Muslims, and Africans'--see the United States as the single greatest threat
to their societies, because of our 'intrusive, interventionist,
exploitative, unilateralist, hegemonic, hypocritical practices' of 'economic
imperialism' and 'intellectual colonialism'." The capitalist party is over.
It is time to give Colin Powell what he needs to save the world--only by
saving the world can we save America."
On this occasion Steele and Professor Stephen Cimbala have re-released their
earlier warning on the need for a new concept of deterrence in the 21st
Century. Their joint communiqu can be downloaded quickly (539 words) from
http://www.oss.net/Papers/white/TodaysAttacks.doc.
Mr. Steele concludes: "America is the greatest country in the world,
but we have lost sight of our moral foundations, failed to listen to our
great strategists Zbigniew Brzezinski and Stephen Metz, and completely
closed down the U.S. Department of State and our foreign assistance
endeavors. It is time for a Global Marshal Plan that respects the fact that
the Whole Earth is a closed system; that does not trivialize today's attacks
as terrorist events; and that wakes up to the fact that money cannot buy
security in a world where asymmetric power is now in the hands of the people
that we have been ignoring and sidelining for over a century."
Mr. Steele is available for telephone interviews at (703) 242-1700.
His high-resolution photograph can be downloaded from
http://www.oss.net/Papers/white/AuthorPhoto.gif. Various white papers on
the 21st Century threat and what to do about it are at
http://www.oss.net/White.html.
SOURCE: Open Source Solutions, Inc.
-0- 09/11/2001
/CONTACT: Robert Steele, OSS CEO,
703-242-1700, or bear@oss.net/
/Web site: www.oss.net
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 86 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:35) * 9 lines
Ted Olsen's wife Barbara, ironically, was on the plane that crashed into
the Pentagon.
ABC News reported that a KAL airliner had been "forced down" and boarded
by the military in Canada - not sure when.
Barbara Olsen was able to contact her husband by cell phone, and reported
that all the passengers had been herded to the rear of the aircraft.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 87 of 803: rachael (rachael) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:41) * 1 lines
Apparently its being suggested now that the 4th plane, that crashed near Pittsburgh, was intercepted and brought down by US forces after it failed to respond to air traffic control and refused to identify itself, and it was on a heading for Camp David - am in UK but have just had this from a friend in Chicago - does anyone know if this is true?
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 88 of 803: Barry Kort (moulton) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:42) * 9 lines
Bush is at Offutt AFB in Omaha, home of the Strategic Air Command.
Boston has not been evacuated. Logan Airport has been closed and people have been asked to leave.
The only aircraft flying over Boston today are delta-wing military aircraft, perhaps an F-15 or F-16.
I'm gonna guess that the hijackers somehow disabled the crew, perhaps with gas, which would be easy enough to get through security, and then took over the controls of the plane. This is just my own personal speculation.
I expect our nation will now enter a phase of crisis fatigue.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 89 of 803: rachael (rachael) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:44) * 1 lines
Apparently its being suggested now that the 4th plane, that crashed near Pittsburgh, was intercepted and brought down by US forces after it failed to respond to air traffic control and refused to identify itself, and it was on a heading for Camp David - am in UK but have just had this from a friend in Chicago - does anyone know if this is true?
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 90 of 803: Barry Kort (moulton) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:45) * 1 lines
I have heard no reliable reports of how the fourth plane went down near Pittsburgh, but it's possible that it was forced down by an interceptor, as this plane was on a considerably later timetable than the first three. The military would have had time to respond.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 91 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:45) * 1 lines
A govt spokesperson has just refuted that rumor about shooting down the plane.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 92 of 803: Laura T (LauraT) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:46) * 1 lines
Rachael, all the info I've heard about the Pittsburgh plane has been unconfirmed, but I've also heard the same thing. Hopefully there will be more details later.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 93 of 803: Barry Kort (moulton) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:46) * 1 lines
Terry, is your server on GMT?
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 94 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:46) * 1 lines
Outside Omaha, Nebraska is the Strategic Air Command. Then there is Norad just outside of Colorado Springs. Been there. They don't welcome stangers!
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 95 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:48) * 39 lines
from unidentified source:
An attorney named Tom Humphries is being interviewed by Jennings now. He
was on the 57th floor in one of the buildings--they cut into the interview
in progress so I'm not sure which one--oh, it would have been the first
building hit.
57th floor. Took him 45 minutes to get down the staircase. He said people
were calm, and helping each other. Asked about whether there were lights,
he said, "Last time there weren't, this time there were." (God. "Last
time.")
Only one stairwell was open, the others were blocked by smoke. The first
building took some time before it imploded, and he thinks a large number of
people got out.
(The second building got hit later and collapsed sooner. I hope they were
already evacuating after the first building was hit.)
Jennings: "I must say I'm amazed how calm you are, after having been in the
first bombing in 1993 and now this."
Humphries chuckles briefly. "I'm happy to be here."
Humphries says the evacuation down one narrow stairway was "a recipe for
disaster" but everyone's calmness kept it from becoming one.
He talked to someone from Tower 2, who was on the 88th floor. They started
evacuating after Tower 1 was hit, and that person got out.
He says, "I think the tragedy is, the police and fire people who were trying
to help people were right under the building when that happened"--the
collapse--"They were at ground zero."
I think this simple interview has started to break through my wall of shock.
Listening to a very calm man who was in the building and walked down 57
floors with thousands of heroically self-composed people describe that. I
am, goddamnit, starting to believe this.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 96 of 803: Barry Kort (moulton) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:49) * 1 lines
Terry, is your server on GMT?
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 97 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:49) * 1 lines
Yeah, I need to fix that again. I keep setting it for CST and it reverts to GMT.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 98 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:53) * 29 lines
More unidentified reports:
source a:
Some terrorism experts are saying that the only ones who could pull this
off
are the CIA-trained fundamentalist terrorists in afganistan... we taught
them to take down the local great satan -- the USSR -- and now they are
turning their attention to the rilly rilly great satan. They do not have
headquarters. they do not have known leaders. they are good with
technology. They can organize. they are willing to die. they don't
care
if someone else takes the blame.
This second hand from someone who is interviewing experts and pundits.
source b:
My guess is that the hijackers flew first class, maybe spent some time
in the Red Carpet Club before boarding the flights, and didn't appear to
be palestinian freedom fighters. Maybe Japanese businessmen if the
announcement by the Japanese Red Army is accurate.
And another report:
BBC News reporting that a building close to the site of the WTC is at
risk
of collapse as a result of the towers collapsing.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 99 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:55) * 1 lines
Outside Omaha, Nebraska is the Strategic Air Command. Then there is Norad just outside of Colorado Springs. Been there. They don't welcome stangers!
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 100 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (16:57) * 1 lines
They are identifying it as Building 7
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 101 of 803: rachael (rachael) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (17:00) * 1 lines
BBC suggested that the hijackers were probably domestic passengers not international, ie boarded in the US, because passports aren't needed for internal flights (obviously)
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 102 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (17:00) * 9 lines
This just in, in a day full of "this just in's"
BBC News reporting that a building close to the site of the WTC is at
risk of collapse as a result of the towers collapsing.
So is NPR.
BBC now reporting that the building is the 40 storey Sallmon Bros
building. And that it has collpased now.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 103 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (17:07) * 1 lines
No other building has collapsed yet.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 104 of 803: rachael wallis (rachael) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (17:08) * 1 lines
blood donor centres running low - all who can are urged to donate as a matter of urgency
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 105 of 803: Karen Rosenberg (KarenR) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (17:25) * 3 lines
The third building (#7) has collapsed. CNN just confirmed. Also says there are fears about another (#5).
CNN is interviewing Tom Clancy now.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 106 of 803: Moon Dreams (Moon) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (17:26) * 16 lines
I don't know if you have seen this:
Knives on Board
(techstudies2000) Sep 11, 16:49
Tuesday Sept. 11, 2001; 4:35 p.m. EDT
Flight Attendants Stabbed Aboard Twin Tower Kamikaze Plane
A violent struggle with knife-wielding terrorists took place outside the cockpit of one of two hijacked planes before it slammed into the World Trade Center Tuesday morning, a flight attendant on board reported to American Airlines before her death.
"A flight attendant on that plane was apparently able to call the American Airlines operations center to tell them that two flight attendants had been stabbed and that the perpetrators had broken into the flight deck," ABC Radio News reported.
The plane was enroute from Boston to Los Angeles when it was commandeered by terrorists for its kamikaze mission.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 107 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (17:28) * 1 lines
That last building was 47 stories tall.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 108 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (17:31) * 1 lines
CNN is now showing some new closeup footage (from PAX TV) of the second plane hitting. What it shows is the plane going right into the building and possibly coming through the other side.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 109 of 803: Beth (Bethanne) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (17:32) * 11 lines
As to the Pittsburgh plane being brought down "intentionally"....I heard that its suspected target was Camp David and, that fighter jets took it down before it could reach its target.
I have no problem understanding how these terrorists and their weapons, could get past airport security at Logan and Dulles, if their security is anything like it is here in Atlanta. Totally disinterested kids, poorly trained and motivated man the security check points here. It would take very little effort to "sneak" something past them.
The security level at US airports here in the US is very, very, very minimal compared to that at European airports. In Europe, only passengers can enter the Departure Concourse and Lounges. You can not meet someone directly off a plane in Europe, the way you can over here. Also, in Europe you go thru many, many checkpoints and security before you get on your flight. I just wish to God, US airports were as fussy.
Twoyearsago I flew from the US to Ireland via London, but I flew back via Glasgow. As I was sitting in the airport in Glasgow, waiting for my flight to Chicago,I was paged on the airport intercom to report back to the American Airlines desk. I was then grilled by the security forces for 2 hours in a tiny little room, which terrifed me witless. Apparantly, an Irish person entering the UK thru one airport and exiting thru another, raised a red flag on some security services computer and I was deemed a "terrorist threat".
As the IRA was very active in the UK at the time, I did my best to understand that these were just people who were doing their job. After my nerves and heart rate returned to normal, I was actually kind of happy that the security forces were taking such "extreme" steps to ensure the safety of airline passengers. I would love to see US airports be equally vigilant.
Sorry if I am waffleing....I'm just at a loss, like the rest of you, in trying to comprehend the horror of this carnage.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 110 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (17:49) * 13 lines
ABC's Claire Shipman reporting the President is on his way to Washington and
will make a statement tonight; "We're told he's angry about what happened
and very much wants to make a statement". Congressional leaders also
returning from their safe haven, also will make statements.
"There's apparently a real premium here in Washington among the leaders of
presenting a face of business as usual," she says. The leadership has been
warned of the risk but feels it's important to be in Washington. The
President will be landing in D.C. where they feel the airspace is as safe as
anywhere in the nation. Vice President Cheney will then be removed from the
White House as a precaution, though the First Lady is expected to join her
husband.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 111 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (17:53) * 41 lines
To: "Red Rock Eater News Service"
Subject: [RRE]attack
From: Phil Agre
Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 13:58:22 -0700
Here are some more URL's relating to the attacks this morning.
a backup site that generally works when cnn.com does not
http://robots.cnn.com/
video of the second plane in New York
high bandwidth:
http://www.nytimes.com/library/national/091101plane1-large.html
low bandwidth:
http://www.nytimes.com/library/national/091101plane1-small.html
people's stories
http://ap.tbo.com/ap/breaking/MGAVZWE2IRC.html
Hotline from the National Journal can be accessed today for free
http://hotlinescoop.com/web/content/hotline.htm
http://nationaljournal.com/pubs/hotline/extra/lastcall/
this site will register people who are safe
http://do.millennium.berkeley.edu/
you can query this site to search for people
http://do.millennium.berkeley.edu/find.php
military analysis
http://www.janes.com/
photos from Brooklyn of the buildings collapsing
http://www.indigo23.com/
an architect discussing how the buildings collapsed
http://home.actlab.utexas.edu/pipermail/discuss/2001-September/000226.html
Engineers Shocked By Towers Collapse
http://chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/chi-010911kamin-towers.story
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 112 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (17:54) * 2 lines
a great archive of World Trade Center stuff at
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 113 of 803: Liz K (ekelley) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (17:58) * 5 lines
7 WT is the one that just collapsed. I was in that building just a few months ago, visiting my friend. He works (or worked...I don't know if he's ok yet...I hate this) for the city Office of Emergency Management. He took me into the "Bunker" where the command center was. it was built to withstand the blast of a nuclear bomb, a category 5 hurricane, and some other disasters. I don't think they ever thought that tower 1 would collapse onto it.
they have cut us off on Long Island. The only way we can get off (if we needed to) are the 2 Connecticut ferries from Pt. Jefferson and Orient Point. They have closed all of the highways, and most of the schools. People are panicing, unfortunately...long lines at the supermarket, gas stations (which I did myself), etc. If this is what war feels like... *sob*
thank you all for being here and reading this, and for all of your thoughts. it helps more than you know.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 114 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (17:58) * 24 lines
Regarding the stability of the towers:
From < http://www.enr.com/new/A0816.asp>
Before foundation excavation began, the 500 x 1,000-ft site was enclosed
by a 3-ft-thick, 70-ft-high concrete cutoff wall built by the slurry
trench wall method and keyed 3 ft into rock. Excavation was complicated by
two nearby subway tubes that had to be supported without service
interruption. A six-level basement was built in the foundation
hole. Excavation of 1.2 million cu yd of earth and rock created $90
million of real estate for project owner, the Port of New York
Authority. Instead of being trucked off for disposal, spoil was used to
create 23 acres of fill in the Hudson River adjacent to the WTC site. It
has since been developed as Battery Park City.
The twin towers had the world's highest load-bearing walls. Seattle-based
structural engineer Worthington, Skilling, Helle and Jackson designed them
as vertical cantilevered steel tubes. Exterior columns are 14-in. square
hollow box sections spaced 39 in. center-to-center. Spandrels welded to
the columns at each floor make them into huge Vierendeel trusses. Each
tower is 208 x 208 ft with a column-free interior between the outer walls
and the 79-ft x 139-ft core.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 115 of 803: rachael (rachael) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (17:58) * 3 lines
further to Beth's post above about security, here's an article from the BBC comparing security at US and UK airports - having been pulled over twice in the UK as a frequent UK/Ireland flyer, one body search, one bag search, I'd agree its annoying at the time, but then you think you'd rather be safe and you're glad it happens ...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/americas/newsid_1538000/1538682.stm
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 116 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (18:01) * 1 lines
There are explosions in Kabul now. Missiles, tracer fire. Antiaircraft fire.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 117 of 803: Liz K (ekelley) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (18:08) * 1 lines
4 F-16s just flew over my house... and now Kabul... Lord help us all.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 118 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (21:48) * 20 lines
Some incredible photos.
http://www.alternet.org/graphics/story_hirez/terrorist1.jpg
http://www.alternet.org/graphics/story_hirez/terrorist2.jpg
http://www.alternet.org/graphics/story_hirez/terrorist3.jpg
http://www.alternet.org/graphics/story_hirez/terrorist4.jpg
http://www.alternet.org/graphics/story_hirez/terrorist5.jpg
http://www.alternet.org/graphics/story_hirez/terrorist6.jpg
http://www.alternet.org/graphics/story_hirez/terrorist7.jpg
http://www.alternet.org/graphics/story_hirez/terrorist8.jpg
http://www.alternet.org/graphics/story_hirez/terrorist9.jpg
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 119 of 803: LeeM (WinniePeg) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (21:50) * 4 lines
I am still in shock over today's events and wondering how this could have happened. I am in Canada and think this is the first time I have EVER heard of the Cdn/USA border being closed. I am amazed at how much security has gone into place so quickly. All airports shut down (only taking diverted overseas flights that were to land in U.S.) In our small city, streets to airport are all blocked--no one allowed into or out of airport. Extra police/customs are in place at border already. Cdn.fighter jets had to escort two Korean Air/Lines into Whitehorse airport today when they did not respond to hail.
In a total state of disbelieve! HOW COULD THIS HAPPEN??
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 120 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (21:54) * 3 lines
San Francisco Bay and its bridges and industries and Alameda are all being partolled by AWACS planes this night. There are frightened citizens there, and I worry for them, as well.
We are ALL in a state of total disbelief. They have stopped selling stuff on QVC and HSC out of respect... That has to be a first.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 121 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (22:06) * 13 lines
It happened because we didn't answer many wake up calls.
It happened because minimum wage people do security at airports.
It happened because we were thinking about a missle defense system instead of tightening up our obvious security holes.
Ebay is full of people selling ghoulish mementos and wtc related domain names.
I'm still in shock, I've been channel surfing the major networks, ABC is the only one that hasn't given this whole thing a big garish name. Peter Jennings and Diane Sawyer are doing some pretty good, calm, balanced coverage.
Bush's speech made it clear we won't just go after the terrorists but those harboring the terrorists.
This is the beginning of a campaign on worldwide terror.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 122 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (22:08) * 41 lines
http://news.mpr.org/features/200109/11_newsroom_terrorist/
has photos and also live radio clips.
The image of the plane slicing through (from the other side of the building)
is shocking. It's in the national images slideshow, the caption reads:
"An amateur photographer was snapping a photograph of the damage to one
World Trade Center tower at the instant when a second airliner
crashed into the other tower.
(credit pending) "
From: info@kauf.com
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 02:47:49 +0200
To: david@trufun.com
Subject: Press release: Help for terror victims by Internet
Ladies and Gentlemen
Victims and their relatives of the terrorist attacks can get help by
Internet. At http://www.wtchelp.com or http://66.33.42.252 they can add a
special notice for searching a person and get further information. The
Internet page was developed by the company Kaufcom for the WTC Help
Organization. Within shortest time, further information and auxiliary
functions will be provided to offer a fast and easy help.
The WTC Help Organization was found at the 11th of September 2001. Our goal
is it to support the victims and their relatives with the best possible help
by using the new medias. The WTC Help Organization stays in contact with many
other organisations.
Patrick Hofer
WTC-Help Organization
Neue Winterthurerstr. 30
CH-8305 Dietlikon
Switzerland
Fax: +41 1 888 43 16
Email:hofer@kaufcom.ch
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 123 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (22:15) * 8 lines
Orrin Hatch said a month a go they knew there was going to be a big attack.
Barbara Walters is reporting this and Peter Jennings is appealing on him to explain this more clearly.
Hatch is saying he has the real data that Ohsama Bin Ladin did this.
He's saying we have about 24 hours to act and round up the terrorists before they go underground.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 124 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (22:40) * 3 lines
There is not a message board anywhere that has not talked about this. Every single Yahoo club to which I belong is talking about it. Mostly how numb everyone feels. Non-US people reacting with sadness and condolences and the same determination to win this match.
Don't mess with those I love. I am ready to do what must be done!!!
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 125 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (22:53) * 5 lines
From Reuters
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 126 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (22:54) * 1 lines
http://reuters.com/ go look at the large photo... it is astounging!
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 127 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (23:09) * 78 lines
Subject: report from NYC...
Date: Tuesday, September 11, 2001 5:36 PM
From: Michael McDonough
To: Bruce Sterling
It started at 8:45 AM with the missile-like scream of something flying
too low and fast across the city's heart, followed by a thump that
shook the ground. Something is wrong.
Minutes later, a second thump. The city empties into the streets. TVs
come alive with live video feeds of the planes striking the south sides
of the towers. I photograph the fires from my SoHo roof, capturing the
north sides on film. The fire has penetrated the towers and is licking
up the facades, bright orange tongues through inky black smoke.
But the towers are not the towers, they are one tower and one smoky
billow the size of an atomic cloud. People are jumping from the upper
stories of the remaining tower. A short time later, now on the streets,
my wife and I are talking to strangers, exchanging information got
from blaring car radios.
Mid-sentence, the second tower implodes before our eyes, only a few
blocks away, glass shards blowing out from the smoky, collapsing core.
Like nightmarish snow, they glisten and sparkle, then disappear. On a
normal day, over 100,000 persons pass through the WTC. We have just
seen a large number of them vaporized.
Debris, chunks of the buildings the size of city buses and automobiles
rain down onto the streets of Lower Manhattan. The collapses at first
take the tops of the towers. In a matter of seconds, the remaining,
lower reaches are infernos. The facades of the towers have fallen onto
the surrounding streets. A woman in the hotel next to the towers
reports seeing legions of firefighters, police, and medical personnel
disappeared beneath the rubble in an instant. Now the explosions have
killed not only those in the towers, but those trying to save them on
the ground.
Elsewhere in the city, as the day grinds on, businesses and shops are
closed, locked tight with security gates in place. All civilian
vehicular transportation in and out of the city stops. The tunnels are
sealed off and empty. The bridges are available for those who want to
hike out of the city.
At early evening I walk the police cordons around lower Manhattan. On
the local streets, urgent laser printed pleas for blood donations are
taped to mailboxes and street lamps. Black SUVs with darkened windows
scream through intersections in long lines, with sirens and flashing
lights. Ambulances from New Jersey and Long Island, and Upstate New
York--townships 60 miles and more outside of New York City--course the
streets; 20, 30 at a time, they move, heading north to hospitals and
triage centers.
Military planes dart overhead, then disappear. The city is an uneasy
silence broken on occasion by piecing, crackling sounds, warnings and
urgent communications. Thousands of people stare blank-eyed and quiet
as they watch the buildings all over downtown burn. Dozens of
construction workers loaded on trucks--welding kits, steel barriers,
men and material--head south, to ground zero. Fire engines line the
west side arterial roads, empty, their occupants fighting the
out-of-control fires on foot.
Military vehicles start to appear. The trucks and cars near the center
are shattered, crushed, lost in a hail of ash and metal and concrete.
New fires start. Smoke billows easterly, against white smoke against
the blue sky of our mid-September day. More buildings are burning.
Another flaming, 40 story pile falls.
We are helpless; we watch. Cars are burning. Mercury from a million
fluorescent lights, PCBs from miles of electrical components, dioxin
from football fields of synthetic carpets and miles of PVC piping
placed throughout the complex, a toxic, now gray soup belching from the
flaming, collapsing hulks. It is as if the city has lost its arms, and
is staring blankly at where they used to be, finding flaming, smoking
voids in their stead.
Michael McDonough
New York City
9/11
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 128 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (23:15) * 7 lines
from another board:
scutmonkey
Posted On 09/11/01 07:55PM
I have a friend that works for Delta Airlines HQ here in Atlanta that person had a couple things to say. One is that the plane over Pennsylvania was intentionally run into the ground by the pilot. All four of those aircraft had radio communications and were describing what was happening at least in the beginning. They issued special emergency codes as well. The pilots locked the cabin doors, but there is a key with the flight attendants that is hidden in a different place on each flight. The terrorist began stabbing crew members and passengers until someone told them where it was. The crew believed that this was a typical hostage and ransom situation and gave up the keys. When the pilots of the Pennsylvania plane realized it wasn't from the other incidents they crashed the jet.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 129 of 803: Annette Mercer (laughingsky) * Tue, Sep 11, 2001 (23:36) * 1 lines
I went into a hospital meeting at 7:30am and came out at 9:00am (CST) this a.m., only to discover that the world was suddenly going to hell! Here in middle Tennessee, the lines are growing longer outside the gas stations...the small town streets are crowded with cars trying to fill up and beat the iminent gas hikes that are rumored to occur by morning. A neighbor works close to the Tennessee/Alabama line and was told that gas in Alabama had shot up to $10.00 a gallon.....jeez....BTW, Thanks to all of you who have expressed condolences on this board. Your support is greatly needed and appreciated!
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 130 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (01:56) * 73 lines
The Boston Herald is breaking some amazing details:
WAR: Hub terror suspects ID'd: Bush vows retaliation after devestating attack
by Ed Hayward, Tom Farmer and Cosmo Macero Jr.
Wednesday, September 12, 2001
Authorities in Massachusetts identified at least five Arab men as suspects in
yesterday's terror attacks launched from Logan International Airport, seizing in the central parking garage a car laden with Arabic-language flight training manuals, sources said last night.
Two of the men, whose passports were traced to the United Arab Emirates, were brothers, one of whom was a trained pilot, a source told the Herald, speaking on condition of anonymity.
At least two other suspects flew to Logan yesterday from Portland, Maine, where authorities believe they had traveled after crossing over from Canada recently.
Once in the air, the hijackers in one plane began killing flight attendants in order to lure a pilot from the cockpit and seize the plane, said one source.
``They started killing stewardesses in the back of the plane as a diversion. The pilot came back to help and that is how they got into the cockpit,'' said the source. The source could not specify whether those events took place on the American Airlines flight that left Logan, or the United Airlines flight. Both planes were plunged into the World Trade Center roughly an hour after they departed Boston.
The suspects had no guns, but used shaving kits and other carry-on luggage to smuggle knife-like weapons made up of plastic handles embedded with razor blades, sources familiar with last night's developments said. That finding is consistent with reports of a flight attendant's cell-phone call from one of the doomed airliners.
``People were calling from the plane saying they were getting killed, calling 911,'' said one source. ``One stewardess called her husband to say goodbye.''
Authorities were led to the rental car by a civilian who got into an altercation with several Arab men as they were parking their car, identified by sources as a Mitsubishi sedan.
The man, whose name was not available last night, called state police from an out-of-state airport after his own flight landed yesterday and he learned planes hijacked from Logan had been involved in attacks that toppled the World Trade Center's twin towers, crippled the Pentagon and downed another airliner in Pennsylvania.
The car, rented from National Rental Car, was secured yesterday by the FBI and authorities have prepared a search warrant. It was unclear when the warrant would be served.
State police interviewed more than 130 people at the airport yesterday, as America launched what is expected to be the largest criminal investigation in its history.
Investigators suspect the two brothers identified by Bay State investigators were aboard United Airlines Flight 175.
The terror plot included the hijacking and crashing of four airliners, including one into the Pentagon, where the Arlington, Va., fire chief estimated the death toll at up to 800.
In New York last night, Mayor Rudolph Guiliani told reporters some people are alive in the rubble of the trade center complex, and there was an unconfirmed report of a cop being pulled out alive last night. There was also a report that survivors trapped in the collapsed buildings were making cell-phone calls.
A horrified nation witnessed the shocking carnage as the World Trade Center's ``North Tower'' burned and exploded after it was struck just before 9 a.m. by Los Angeles-bound American Airlines Flight 11, which departed Boston's Logan Airport at 7:59 a.m. with 81 passengers, two pilots and nine flight attendants.
A second jet - United Airlines Flight 175, that left Logan for L.A. at 8:14 a.m. carrying 56 passengers, seven attendants and two pilots - was captured on video as it sliced through the ``South Tower'' and unleashed a massive fireball just after 9 a.m.
Just moments before the first crash, air traffic controllers heard the lone voice of the terror plot speaking from the cockpit of one doomed aircraft.
``We have more planes, we have other planes,'' a voice alleged to be that of a hijacker could be heard saying through a microphone activated by a pilot of American Airlines Flight 11, the Christian Science Monitor reported on its Web site.
Establishing the death toll could take weeks. The four airliners alone carried 266 people, none known to survive. At the Pentagon, as many as 800 people could be dead, including plane victims.
Roughly 50,000 people worked at the World Trade Center and there was an hour available for evacuations. But the toll already appeared staggering for the men and women who worked to save lives. A firefighters union official said an estimated 200 firefighters had died. An estimated 87 police officers were missing.
Within two hours of the initial Trade Center crash, the fiery nightmare gave way to mind-numbing grief, as both towers imploded, raining thick dust, glass shards, metal chunks and human remains on the streets below. As the twin symbols of American capitalism's global reach crashed to the ground in a smoking heap of dust and debris, the Pentagon burned after another fiery strike - this time American Airlines Flight 77, which left Dulles Airport in Washington, D.C., for Los Angeles with 58 passengers, four attendants and two pilots.
A fourth hijacked plane, United Airlines Flight 93, carrying 38 passengers, two pilots and five flight attendands out of Newark, N.J., crashed in Pennsylvania with its intended target believed to be the presidential retreat at Camp David.
Officials assembled a massive team of investigators as harrowing details of the hijackings began to emerge, culled from desperate cell-phone and radio calls made by passengers and crew: ``One of the pilots keyed their mike so the conversation between the pilot and the person in the cockpit could be heard,'' an unamed controller told the paper. ``The person in the cockpit was speaking English. He was saying something like, `Don't do anything foolish. You're not going to get hurt.' ''
The Los Angeles-bound plane requested a flight path for John F. Kennedy Airport, but then its tracking transponder was shut off and it veered toward the Manhattan skyline.
A flight attendant aboard Flight 11 called superiors to report two flight attendants had been stabbed and hijackers had broken into the cockpit, ABC News reported. The attendant also relayed the seat number of one hijacker before the plane struck the Trade Center.
U.S. Attorney General John Ashcroft confirmed knives were believed to have been used in the Flight 11 hijacking. Aboard American Airlines Flight 93, just moments before it crashed into the Pentagon, Barbara Olson, wife of Solicitor General Ted Olson, called her husband on a cell phone to tell him hijackers wielding knives and box cutters had hearded passengers and crew into the back of the plane.
``She called her husband twice during the hijacking to tell him the plane had been hijacked, and they lost contact once and she called back,'' reported CNN, where Barbara Olson worked as a commentator.
``She said to Ted, `What do I tell the pilot to do?' CNN reported. ``But there was nothing they could do, they were all kept in the back of the plane.''
In Pennsylvania, an emergency dispatcher received a cell-phone call at 9:58 a.m. from a man who said he was a passenger locked in a bathroom aboard United Flight 93, said dispatch supervisor Glenn Cramer in neighboring Westmoreland County. ``We are being hijacked, we are being hijacked!'' Cramer quoted the man from a transcript of the call. The man told dispatchers the plane ``was going down. He heard some sort of explosion and saw white smoke coming from the plane and we lost contact with him,'' Cramer said.
Virginia Rep. James Moran said the intended target of the plane was apparently Camp David, the presidential retreat in Maryland, 85 miles away from the crash site.
Robert Fitzpatrick, a former second-in-command in the FBI's Boston office, said Boston appears to have been the staging area for the attack on New York and the hijackers most likely had help from others who may still be in Boston.
``There's a terrorist cell operating out of Boston,'' Fitzpatrick said. ``They had to have support, they had to have people on the ground, in Boston, supporting them.''
http://www.bostonherald.com/news/local_regional/ausattk09122001.htm
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 131 of 803: Renata (Renata) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (03:43) * 9 lines
This is beyond words, and beyond understanding. I'm still trying to find words to tell you what I feel about the unspeakable, unimaginable. My thoughts are with all who suffer, the innocent victims, and their families and friends, and with the American people.
I send my heartfelt condolences from Germany - we are all with you.
Whatever the intention was of this senseless killing, it goes empty: it will unite - has already united - all freedom-loving people all over the world.
Take care all of you.
Renate
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 132 of 803: Aniutek (Anek) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (04:44) * 2 lines
I was at work yesterday when my colleague called me to tell that WTC in NY collapsed and that Pentagon was on fire. I couldn't believe in it. I thought he told me a stupid joke. Everything reminded of some films or books, but not real life. But then I went to news website and the truth struck me with shock.
Today I've read your news reports and can't stop thinking about the people trapped in the burning building and those who were caugh in the hijacked planes. The senseless cruelty and detailed preparation of the operation is sth beyond my understanding. I'm joining in grief with everyone and I do hope than anything like this will not happen again.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 133 of 803: suzee (suzee202000) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (04:47) * 80 lines
More on United Flight 93 from today's Miami Herald:
Passenger called wife from cell phone shortly before Pittsburgh crash
By Paul Rogers and Lisa Fernandez
Knight Ridder
SAN JOSE, Calif. (12:30 a.m. EDT) -- It might have been the final resistance of a doomed pilot. Or a heroic struggle by a Bay Area passenger. Or a miscalculation by terrorists.
But if there was one glimmer of good news amid the numbing enormity of Tuesday's terrorist attacks, it shined in the wreckage of a United Airlines 757, a flight once bound for San Francisco and instead now strewn across a remote field in the coal country of southwestern Pennsylvania.
Unlike three other commercial jets that were purposely slammed into the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, United Flight 93, for some reason yet unknown, did not hit a terrorist's target Tuesday morning and did not kill thousands of people.
The flight crashed instead at 10:06 a.m. EDT in a wooded area 70 miles southeast of Pittsburgh, near Shanksville, Pennsylvania, two hours after it left Newark, N.J.
All 45 people on board were killed, said Bill Crowley, a special agent with the FBI in Pittsburgh. Among them were 38 passengers, five flight attendents and two pilots.
Minutes before the fiery impact, at least two passengers telephoned from the plane.
One man phoned 911, yelling to dispatchers "We are being hijacked! We are being hijacked!'' before the signal was lost. The other, Tom Burnett, 38, the vice president of a Pleasanton, Calif., medical devices company and father of three children, called his wife, Deena, and may have indicated he and other passengers were about to attempt to overpower the hijackers.
Burnett told his wife that somebody on the plane had been stabbed, said Father Frank Colacicco, of St. Isidore's Church in Danville.
"We're all gonna die, but three of us are going to do something,'' Burnett told his wife, according to Colacicco. He added: "I love you honey'' before the call ended.
FBI agents were interviewing members of the family Tuesday night.
The FBI said that 40 agents and more than 150 other investigators were combing the crash site as darkness fell, including agents from the Department of Alcohol Tobacco and Firearms, the FAA and the Pennsylvania State Police.
Like the three other doomed jets that took off, and then suddenly veered off course, United Flight 93 sharply turned south after nearing Cleveland. One Congressman told Knight Ridder that some investigators believe the plane's hijackers were attempting to crash into either Camp David, the presidential retreat located 80 miles south of the crash site, at Thurmond, Maryland, or the Capitol Building in Washington, D.C.
"There was concern that it was heading in the direction of Washington, D.C.,'' said Rep. Jim Moran, D-Virginia.
Moran said that Capitol police named the two potential targets in a briefing he received from them.
Sen. Dianne Feinstein, D-California, described Tuesday as a national tragedy and the scope is only just beginning to sink in.
"At Pearl Harbor, there were 2,000 people killed,'' Feinstein said.
"This could be tens of thousands.''
United Airlines did not release the passenger list from Flight 93 on Tuesday. At least one other Bay Area resident was confirmed dead, a female student at Santa Clara University. The name of the woman, a junior, was not being released, pending notification of her family, said Barry Holtzclaw, a spokesman for the university.
"I'm shattered by this,'' said Holtzclaw. "''The scale of it, the enormity of it, the buildings and the loss off life. The mood of the campus tomorrow will be very very somber.''
It may be weeks before it is known what happened in the doomed flight, experts said.
"It fits the same pattern of the other ones,'' said a high-ranking FAA official. "The moves of the plane are similar to what you would see if a struggle or some violent problem occurred in the cockpit.''
Gary Joseph, who co-pilots United 747-400 flights from San Francisco to Shanghai, said he believes the pilots aboard Flight 93 tried to prevent the terrorists from taking control of the aircraft.
"They train you to do whatever they say, but that only goes so far,'' Joseph said. "If he had any idea what they were planning, I'm sure he tried to fight them off.''
Joseph said a pilot may try to make sharp turns and dive . . . much the way initial radar records show the plane did in its final minutes in the air . . . to throw a would-be hijacker off balance.
"There's been cases where they do that and get control back of the plane. But a jet can only take so much of a dive before it starts to fall apart, I don't know.''
Joseph said it wasn't clear whether the crew was a San Francisco-based one or a New York-based group, because the airline has crews stationed in each city.
No family members showed up at San Francisco International Airport to greet the passengers at its normal 11:15 a.m. arrival time, said Ron Wilson, spokesman for San Francisco International Airport. That is possibly because United employees in Chicago reached many of them before they left home.
Dozens of clergy members gathered at United's VIP lounge to await survivors. San Francisco Mayor Willie Brown cancelled his trip to meet the victims' families when it appeared nobody would show up.
The Boeing 757 seats about to 200 passengers, which means Flight 93 was less than a quarter full.
The crash scene is located near one of America's worst civilian disaster, the site of the 1889 Johnstown flood, in which 2,200 people perished when the South Fork Dam collapsed.
Jim Marker, a Somerset, Pennsylvania County Commissioner, visited the crash site and said the FBI was investigating the possibility that the plane suffered an explosion before it crashed. The passenger who phoned Westmoreland County dispatchers also said there was an explosion, the Associated Press reported.
"They are checking about a mile from the site for some debris that might show there was an explosion,'' said Marker. "They do believe there was that possibility.''
Others in the small town said the crash rocked the area, like an earthquake.
"It was 2 miles away, but it shook everything,'' said Bruce Grine, owner of Grine's Service Center in Shanksville. "It shook the windows. We saw smoke. Then the smell. Then somebody came running up the street and said a plane crashed. God, it was terrible.''
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 134 of 803: Rob Glennie (AotearoaKiwi) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (06:10) * 8 lines
Hi all
First off, I extend my deepest sympathy to all who lost loved ones in today cowardly attacks. Second I call for a cool headed response (NOT one of a deranged lunatic hopping around like a crazed devil barking orders). I know that many of you are outraged and that some want war, but BELIEVE ME WHEN I SAY THIS: HASTE NEVER HAS AND NEVER WILL PAY OR BEGIN TO PAY FOR WHAT HAPPENED. Be patient and let the United States Government establish it's priorities and wait until they find AND confirm the culprits. Then AND ONLY THEN, will it be safe to let the Pentagon of the leash.
I am still coming to grips tonight some 14 hours after Mum tipped me off that the WTC twin towers had been destroyed by a 767 and a 757 and that the Pentagon had been hit by another 767. Although I now understand what happened the SHEER scale of planning that must have gone into the attacks, tell me one thing only:
The person/s who masterminded this evil have a monumental hatred for all things American. They are the sort of people who should be put on show trial in front of the whole nation, and assuming they are found guilty, should be executed in public.
Rob
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 135 of 803: olzuza (olzuza) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (09:42) * 7 lines
Hello everyone,
I am from Poland, when I heard the news yesterday I was stunned - I thought it was a kind of a joke and all those pictures which looked like taken from some movie. I am still in shock as well as my family and friends. I extend my sympathy too all Americans and people who lost someone important and loved. It's a tragedy for whole world and I hope that nothing else like this would never take place.
take care all of you who are in the middle of this tragedy and please,remember that whole civilizated world is with you.
Love,
Alexandra
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 136 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (10:18) * 22 lines
"Taliban rulers deny bin Laden's involvement"
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2001/09/11/taliban-reax.htm
Olzuza, we are all feeling the sadness today, yesterday we were numb with
the shock of this horrible attack on America. This is unprecedented, the
biggest thing that has happened in my lifetime.
unidentified source:
"there's a specific code (7700) a pilot dials in when being hijacked,
which causes all sorts of bells and whistles to go off on a controller's
screen. *That* would be the reason those guys made them turn them off.
Not stupid, at all. Vile, despicable cretins, yes. A plane goes off
course, there's a time lag to 1) notice it, 2) inquire, 3) request
correction or further explanation, 4) decide there's a threat, 5) measure
its gravity, and 6) take action.
The first five steps are covered by dialing-in 7700, a motion in the
cockpit that's not inconsistent with any other miscellaneous fiddling with knobs
and switches necessary to fly the plane.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 137 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (10:28) * 12 lines
http://www.wi2600.org/mediawhore/mirrors/sept-11-problems/asu/www.asu.net/wtc/otherpics/wtc35.jpg
http://www.wi2600.org/mediawhore/mirrors/sept-11-problems/asu/www.asu.net/wtc/otherpics/
This one is horrible:
http://www.wi2600.org/mediawhore/mirrors/sept-11-problems/asu/www.asu.net/wtc/otherpics/wtc55.jpg
A tower about to fall:
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 138 of 803: Anon (curious) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (10:45) * 3 lines
To find out more about donating online, check:
Red Cross and
Helping.org
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 139 of 803: Anon (curious) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (10:46) * 2 lines
oops, typo, the Red Cross is located at
http://www.redcross.org/
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 140 of 803: Eileen (EileenG) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (11:11) * 11 lines
I just can't watch TV anymore. I have to take a break from the unending surreal shots of the planes hitting the towers.
Those of you at Drool know I'm from the NY area. As a child, I watched the towers go up. Yesterday I watched them come down. Like Liz, I know people who worked there and in the nearby Wall St. area. If you've ever visited downtown NYC, you saw the size of these buildings. If you went up to Windows on the World, the public restaurant, you experienced how high they were. Yesterday, one of our local newscasters felt himself important enough to provide encouragement by declaring 'we made it through Oklahoma City and Columbine and we'll make it through this.' Not to minimize those other tragedies, but the enormous numbers of victims who lost their lives yesterday cannot be compared to those other incidents.
I now live outside DC (quite a distance from the Pentagon). Our normally quiet skies were filled with military aircraft yesterday. All's quiet again today.
My sister works in upper Manhattan. I'm still trying to find out if she made it out of the city last night.
I'll be back to the TV soon because I am fascinated by reports about the many calls made from the planes, how the FBI is progressing in their investigation (too much too little too late, IMO), information as to how these sociopaths pulled this off and stories from the survivors.
Lastly, I am trying to wrap my mind's eye around a picture of the NYC skyline without the towers. I drove past them on the Jersey side every day for years. I could see them from almost every town in which I've lived. I saw them this past Sunday and thought 'it's good to be home'. Their absence will forever be a reminder of yesterday's events and the lives lost.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 141 of 803: Anon (curious) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (13:04) * 16 lines
Dear Heavenly Father,
We are moved by the alarming news and crisis that our country is facing.
This, the greatest nation, founded in the belief that "In God We Trust" and
the "Land of the Free". Please have mercy on those suffering, hurting
and in fear, and give wisdom & strength to those who are assisting. May
the forces of evil be broken by your power and may we humble before thee,
our strength and refuge.
Give wisdom to our President and all our leaders and bring your
comforting peace through the power of your Holy Spirit.
Help us here to reach those that have been affected by this tragedy.
In the name of our Lord and Savior, Christ Jesus. Amen.
(Please send this to all your friends and create a prayer chain throughoutthis nation.)
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 142 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (14:13) * 76 lines
Another batch of URLs from Phil Agre:
--
Wall Street Journal coverage
(appears to be available without a subscription)
http://interactive.wsj.com/pages/terattack.htm
Yahoo links to news stories etc
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/fc/US/Terrorism/
eyewitness accounts
http://newsvote.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/talking_point/newsid_1537000/1537530.stm
online mechanisms for donating to the Red Cross
http://www.amazon.com/paypage/PKAXFNQH7EKCX
http://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=p/gen/relief-outside
legal coverage
http://www.law.com/
mailing list to connect people who can volunteer or provide resources
http://207.22.68.76/911volunteers.html
aircraft flight tracks
http://www.aviationnow.com/avnow/spSec/wtcst.jsp
front pages of 50 newspapers' coverage of the attack
http://www.poynter.org/terrorism/pdf1.htm
Current Awareness via Streaming Audio/Video
http://gwu.edu/~gprice/audio.htm
Speech/Transcripts/Statements from US and Foreign Leaders
http://gwu.edu/~gprice/speech.htm
Anonymous Remailer Operators Start to Take Remailers Offline
http://www.inet-one.com/cypherpunks/current/msg00272.html
Middle East Newswire
http://www.middleeastwire.com/newswire/
Two Planes Hit Twin Towers at Exactly the Worst Spot
http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/asection/la-000073606sep12.story
Security Experts Knew a Major Attack Was Possible
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A14031-2001Sep11.html
Insurance Cost for Terrorist Attack to Near $1 Billion
http://www.siliconvalley.com/docs/news/depth/insure091201.htm
Reports: Boston Investigators Find Evidence in Attacks
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20010912/ts/attack_suspects_dc_2.html
civil engineering aspects of the building collapse
http://www.civil.usyd.edu.au/wtc.htm
online discussion site for pilots
http://www.pprune.org/
Rescuers Struggle at Pentagon
http://newsvote.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/americas/newsid_1539000/1539839.stm
Why the Killers Threaten World Prosperity
http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/business/newsid_1538000/1538958.stm
In Shock, Teachers Downplay Tragedy
http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/asection/la-000073649sep12.story
EBay Cancels Auctions of Attack-Related Items
(some idiots were actually gathering rubble in order to sell it on eBay)
http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/asection/la-000073609sep12.story
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 143 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (14:19) * 15 lines
From abcnews.com
ABCNEWS has learned that officials have identified all the hijackers, and
estimated there were three to five for each of the four passenger planes
involved. At least two of the hijackers were on the Immigration and
Naturalization Service "watch list," and it's still unclear whether the
individuals entered the United States illegally or whether they entered
before their names were placed on the list.
Most if not all of the hijackers were Egyptian or Saudi nationals, sources
said.
In Washington, State Department officials said they have intelligence
information that connects the attacks on the twin towers in New York and on
the Pentagon to fugitive Saudi millionaire Osama bin Laden.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 144 of 803: Laura (LauraMM) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (14:31) * 1 lines
Well it's here in Boston. This is ridiculous...
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 145 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (14:43) * 11 lines
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/binladen/who/bio.html
A bio on Bin Laden from pbs.org. Read the disclaimer that the source
is unnamed and the info differs from other bios.
Seems his father is from Yemen but moved to Saudi years before Osama
(one of 50 children? boggles the mind...) was born in '57. Father made
his money in Saudi as a construction mogul, from humble beginnings.
http://msnbc.com/news/190144.asp?cp1=1
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 146 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (14:52) * 345 lines
Subject: Yesterday's bombings [4x]
Date: Wednesday, September 12, 2001 4:12 PM
From: nettime's compiler
Reply-To: "nettime's compiler"
To:
Table of Contents:
The Media: As an Attack Unfolds, a Struggle to Provide Vivid Imag
es to Homes
John Armitage
WTC/Pentagon attac
folks@arthide.de (folks)
Re: New York City
Andrew Ross
It was supposed to be such a beautiful day
"Ivo Skoric"
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 11:42:35 +0100
From: John Armitage
Subject: The Media: As an Attack Unfolds, a Struggle to Provide Vivid
Imag es to Homes
THE NEW YORK TIMES
SEP 12, 2001
http://www.nytimes.com/2001/09/12/national/12MEDI.html?pagewanted=print
The Media: As an Attack Unfolds, a Struggle to Provide Vivid Images to
Homes
By FELICITY BARRINGER and GERALDINE FABRIKANT
Television's broadcast networks and many of its cable channels - both
news and entertainment - scrapped their regular schedules yesterday.
Radio stations took live television news feeds. Two dozen newspapers
published special editions and Web sites threw out their advertising
and in some
cases stripped down to basic text and still images to help their
overtaxed computers handle a demand for news unlike any they had
experienced.
Between the moment when perplexed morning news broadcasters began
fielding calls from Greenwich Village residents who saw a low- flying
plane crash into One World Trade Center and the moment more than an
hour later when New York's twin towers crumbled into Roman candles of
smoky debris, the country's media outlets geared up to become the
public stage of a national emergency.
By noon, all four major television networks had agreed to share video
images. By midafternoon, almost all of AOL Time Warner's cable
channels, like TBS and TNT, were carrying CNN; Viacom's CBS News feed
was being carried by Viacom's music channels, VH1 and MTV; and Peter
Jennings of ABC News was appearing not just on his network, but on
Disney's ESPN channel
and all ABC radio stations.
Most of the networks used variations of the title adopted by CNN:
America Under Attack.
Images of billowing smoke from lower Manhattan and the low, smoldering
profile of the Pentagon, hit, like the Trade Center towers, by a
hijacked commercial jetliner, were dominant on all networks. Referring
to the unusual agreement to share images among the bitterly competitive
news divisions of the networks and CNN, the Fox News president, Roger
Ailes,
said: "All the networks decided that this is a national emergency.
We're
not keeping score today." Nor were they making much money, as they
largely scrapped commercial advertising.
In Washington, where the downtown had become a ghost town after the
federal government was shut down, delivery trucks for The Washington
Post headed for suburban 7- Eleven stores carrying a special edition
dominated by a two-inch headline, "Terror Hits Pentagon, World Trade
Center," with a
lead editorial headlined "War." Special editions were also published
by The Los Angeles Times, The Chicago Tribune, The Newark Star-Ledger,
The Charlotte Observer in North Carolina, The Austin American-Statesman
in Texas, not to mention small dailies like The LaCrosse Tribune in
Wisconsin.
Traffic at news Web sites soared, with 10 times or more the usual
number of users trying to log on, clogging the Internet and slowing
response time.
Because New York was not just ground zero of the opening attack but
also the heartland of the media industry, some of the most dramatic
early accounts were from correspondents working at or near their homes.
Don Dahler, an ABC News correspondent who covered recent civil wars in
Africa, was getting dressed for work in his third-floor apartment in
Tribeca,
perhaps half a mile from the World Trade Center, when he heard the
first plane hit.
"I heard what is a very familiar sound anywhere else in the world, in
war zones," Mr. Dahler said. "It sounded to me like a missile, a high-
pitched scream and a roar followed by an explosion, my mind was telling
me it's a missile. Then I saw this gaping wound in the World Trade
Center. I called into `Good Morning' immediately and started
reporting," standing on his sixth-floor rooftop with a cellular
telephone.
Mr. Dahler, just one of the network's sources, was not on the air when
he felt the first of the two towers collapse. "When it collapsed I
could feel a rumble, and I tried to interrupt to say that something was
happening right before my eyes," he said. "The building collapsed. I
was telling them it looks like its coming down, it looks like it's
coming down. They switched to me right after it had fallen."
If there were a few stutter-steps like that, it was not surprising. It
was one of the rare instances when television brought disaster into
American homes in real time.
The radical changes in the technology of news delivery, however, along
with the quality of video imagery gave most of the day's news
broadcasts the feeling of an epic disaster movie.
The only genuinely grainy imagery came from the most advanced and
portable equipment: CNN's satellite video phones, which allowed that
network alone to televise a news conference with the spiritual leader
of the Taliban
government in Afghanistan, the country that harbors the headquarters
of the accused terrorist, Osama Bin Laden. By evening, the same
equipment was showing tracer fire and explosions in Kabul.
Beyond the vivid pictures, the reporting included a number of mistakes
borne of rumors that sprang up throughout the day. CNN reported that
another plane was headed for the Pentagon. Fox News reported that the
State Department was on fire. CBS News reported that a second airplane
tried to attack the Pentagon. All the reports were later corrected.
The closest major news organization to the scene was The Wall Street
Journal, whose main offices nearby were evacuated at 9:15 a.m.
Reporters and editors worked from home or other Dow Jones offices from
New Jersey to Hong Kong to prepare a Wednesday issue.
Talk radio shows, which sometimes feed on inflammatory commentary,
were unusually low key yesterday, with hosts sympathizing or eliciting
information from eyewitnesses rather than goading.
On the New York radio dial, reporters at news stations struggled to
describe the breadth of the destruction. And talk radio hosts -
sometimes after ominous music played in the background - covered
subjects from airport security to retaliation.
The radio reports played a larger role than usual in bringing news to
the city, since the antennas that broadcast the signals of WABC and
WNBC were destroyed along with the twin towers. New Yorkers without
cable television - about 30 percent to 35 percent of the city's viewers
- could only get
WCBS, whose antenna is on the Empire State Building.
The radio journalists reverted to the techniques of Edward R. Murrow's
wartime broadcasts from London to make the story visual. On WCBS-AM,
the journalist Peter Haskell reported that ambulances were lined up "as
far as the eye can see on both sides of the West Side Highway." On
WINS, the
reporter Steve Kastenbaum said: "It looks like the entire city is just
walking home. The Brooklyn Bridge is a sea of people coming off the
F.D.R. Drive, walking down from Midtown, walking across the East River
to their destinations."
Elsewhere in the country, some stations used the event to set up a
dialogue with listeners. A Christian radio station in Los Angeles,
KFSG-FM, canceled commercial advertising yesterday until 6 p.m. and
used itsafternoon hours to take calls from listeners who wanted to talk
about the attacks.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 13:16:08 +0200
From: folks@arthide.de (folks)
Subject: WTC/Pentagon attac
Historically speaking, THIS is the beginning of the new century,
11.09.2001.
Those who believe in something like humanity, whether the word has
been misused or not, whether someone is fighting against US policy or
not, feels with the innocent people who died and those who now bitterly
miss them.
folks
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 10:16:24 -0500
From: Andrew Ross
Subject: Re: New York City
As someone who's been moving around downtown New York yesterday and
this morning, I'm struck by how many paramilitary vehicles there are on
the streets. The National Guard is here, of course, but there are also
all sorts of very strange-looking vehicles (with unfamiliar acronyms
on the side, if they are identified at all) that you never see on
civilian streets, but which clearly belong to the relevant civil
authorities. All other things aside (which, I realize, is a large
proviso), the atmosphere
is neo-martial, and reminds one of how quickly a dense First World
metro area can and could be commandeered under other circumstances that
one is only left to imagine.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 13:22:14 -0400
From: "Ivo Skoric"
Subject: It was supposed to be such a beautiful day
Yesterday, it was such a beautiful sunny September day in New York
city that the only cloud in the sky was the one raising from the rubble
of the World Trade Center.
I don't think we can be sure as of yet who did it. Osama bin Laden and
his group are obvious suspects - because they already attacked WTC,
and maybe they just came back to finish the job. Hezbollah on the
other hand has the history of trying to crash a hijacked passenger
plane in a building.
And nobody even mentions the non-Arab, non-Palestine related options,
because they are simply to scary to contemplate: like what if this is
'domestic' terrorism?
Regardless, of who did it, however, this was an act of war. This was
the single largest atrocity committed against the U.S. on its soil
since the Declaration of Independence. It is also important to note
that the DoD's beloved Space Shield would do absolutely nothing to
protect the U.S. from such an attack that came from inside and was
executed by the tools of American corporate business (2 passenger jets
owned by the American
Airlines and 2 passenger jets owned by the United Airlines), used
against the symbols of American economic and military might. Doesn't it
look improbable that Pentagon got a direct hit? That was sure enough
to humble American arrogance. Yet, that was not enough for the
terrorists.
That's why I agree with Ruth Wedgwood, a Yale University law professor
and terrorism expert, that this is not only an act of war, but also a
war crime. Crashing a plane full of passengers in a busy city district
at the beginning of a workday should classify clearly as a war crime,
on pair with what people in former Yugoslavia or Rwanda did to each
other. New York yesterday and today feels like Sarajevo felt after
shelling the markeplace. Public transportation did not run, exits from
the city were
closed down, schools are closed, markets are closed, all airports
around the country are shut down, 4000 daily flights are grounded,
hospitals in the city are overwhelmed with hundreds, thousands of
injured, and we don't even know yet the number of victims. People are
eerily calm. Black teenagers here on my corner are unusually quiet and
still. It seems that all passengers in subways got a few more wrinkles
on their faces than they
had yesterday, and everybody is paying the fare, regardless of the
service doors being left wide open. The 'hyper- power' is on its knees.
UN, World Bank, Capitol, White House, Treasury, State Department and
Pentagon are evacuated. And New York will probably never be the same
again. I feel the same emptiness as I felt when Mostar lost the Old
Bridge.
Holy shit - UPS just this moment delivered a package to me -
functioning parcel service suggests return to 'normalcy', that's
encouraging.
About the perpetrators, there are several technical things that are
kind of clear: some of them had to be trained pilots capable of driving
most modern US passenger jets precisely (Iraqis?). The research of the
US flight schedules was done meticulously, as to get a couple of wide
fuselage planes, well filled with fuel (intended to fly accross the
continent), hitting the twin towers from various points of origins
within half an hour. Everything points to terrorists being well
rehearsed and well informed.
I don't see any other way but to have perpetrators and their
supporters brought to justice. Nobody quite expected such a massive,
well co-ordinated (4 airliners hijacked simultaneously at 4 different
airports) and, unfortunately, highly succesfull attack on the land of
the law, such as happened yesterday morning. September 11th will
perhaps be remembered in the world's history, because I can't imagine
world ever be the same
after today in regards to fighting terrorism.
I am obviously afraid that citizens will have to put up with even more
curtailing of their freedoms to assure their safety. I am just
thinking of what nightmare it is going to be to fly inside the US now,
with all the increased security that would be put in place to prevent
of this happening again - that's why, obviously, I would prefer that
the perpetrators are caught sonner than later.
As for the reasons - for quite a while we were all aware of how the
rule of American law may convey injustice to some people. It is this
feeling of injustice and the feeling of helplessness to prevent that
injustice, that breeds anger, rage and hate, and ultimately it breaks
out in irreversible acts of horrific terrorism. It is true that
Palestinians were and still are victims at the hands of the world. And
the routes for them to obtain redress are clogged on purpose for a
long time. So, for a quite a while they resort to terrorism, including
suicidal terrorism.
It is true that during NATO's bombing campaign over Yugoslavia, many
innocent Yugoslav citizens died. And it is also true that during the
Gulf War a much larger number of innocent Iraqis died. Judging by the
celebratory mood on streets of Gaza (and even some e-mail messages that
came from Belgrade), there are people who do feel a sense of poetic
justice in using American passenger planes as cruise missiles to
'punish' the cruise missiles makers. There is no doubt that in some
people's minds the U.S. 'deserved' such a reckoning. I hope the U.S.
would take this into consideration in its search for the
perpetrators and in whatever action it choses to take against them.
>From Manhattan:
ivo skoric
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Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 147 of 803: Beth (Bethanne) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (14:55) * 5 lines
The White House and ABC News have confirmed that the intended target of the plane that crashed in DC, was NOT The Pentagon. It was The White House. OMG !!
The White House have also confirmed that Air Force One and The President, were also intended targets. They have not revealed what brought them to this conclusion.
Thank God these other attacks didn't take place and, that the Secret Service took the evasive measures with Air Force One, that they did.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 148 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (14:55) * 242 lines
From today's Vancouver Sun:
"Wednesday, September 12, 2001
OTTAWA (CP) - Thousands of Canadians from coast to coast responded to
calls for blood donations to help American victims of Tuesday's
catastrophic attacks in New York and Washington.
The hotline set up by Canadian Blood Services for those wishing to
donate has been tied up almost permanently, said spokeswoman Lorna
Tessier.
She urged people to persevere, even though no request for blood has
been received from U.S. authorities.
``We've had such an overwhelming response that the 1-888-2-DONATE line
has been very difficult to get through on.
``Right now, clearly, the clinics are overwhelmed and we are putting
on additional hours and additional clinics, but we don't want people to
get discouraged.
``We are going to need their blood. We're anticipating that the need
will come up.''
She said the agency doesn't have statistics yet on the number of
people who have come forward, but it is in the thousands."
I'd point out that nobody's actually asked us for blood yet, but
people just felt the need to do something to help.
From the National Post:
Canadians offer homes to stranded
400 international jets diverted across country
Wednesday, September 12, 2001
TORONTO and VANCOUVER - International passenger jets crammed Canadian
tarmacs yesterday after all United States airports were closed in the
wake of the terrorist attack that levelled the twin towers of the World
Trade Center in New York.
About 400 planes were expected to be diverted throughout the day,
pouring 10,000 people into Halifax alone.
By late afternoon, Vancouver International Airport had received 34
planes diverted from North American destinations, carrying as many as
6,000 people. Another 25 planes were expected at Lester B. Pearson
International Airport in Toronto. St. John's International Airport
closed its runways after taking in 27 aircraft with 5,000 passengers.
Fifty-seven flights were expected to land into the night at the airport
in Gander, Nfld.
At least 100 controllers and other staff were pulled out of courses
and called in on their time off to help handle the deluge of
international flights, said Paul Hornbeck, a spokesman for Nav Canada,
the agency that handles air traffic control at Canadian airports.
International arrival terminals across the country were choked with
people while departure areas were virtually deserted -- all outbound
flights across Canada were cancelled, except for humanitarian or
search-and-rescue missions, police and military flights.
Passengers stood in line with their luggage, waiting for hours to be
searched before they could be permitted to leave.
Bev Aurich, a traveller from Sydney, Australia, who had been headed to
Anchorage, Alaska, before being grounded in Vancouver, said she did
not mind the inconvenience.
"We shouldn't be upset about missing a little trip, when there is such
devastation in the United States. We're better to be delayed and be
comfortable than to keep to our schedule and risk something," she said.
In Toronto, some airport hotels reacted to the situation by increasing
their rates to the maximum legal tariff. Meanwhile, concerned
residents around the country showed up at airports to offer their homes
to travellers.
"I had to take the energy I felt and direct it," said Ena Bendon, a
Vancouver woman who showed up at the airport to offer accommodation. "I
thought of someone with kids here, terrified. I had to do something."
Lufthansa pilot Axel Algner was flying a passenger jet from Frankfurt
to Chicago when he was told there had been an incident in Manhatten and
all planes were being grounded. It wasn't until he landed his plane in
Toronto that he was informed of the details.
"What I thought is that it was a joke. I couldn't believe it, it's
still hard to believe. It just gives me goosebumps even talking about
it," he said.
Another pilot said he was instructed to lock his cockpit after being
told the news.
On the ground at Pearson, the airport began a news blackout at 10:30
a.m., according to one passenger.
Travellers grouped around fellow passengers with cellphones to learn
the details of what had happened. Others lined up to use payphones.
Rabbis and Roman Catholic priests were brought in to counsel
passengers.
In Calgary, which took at least ten diverted flights, every hotel room
was filled by early afternoon, but tourism officials said residents
were opening up their homes to travellers.
In Winnipeg, hotels were also booked solid by early afternoon,
prompting the city to invoke its emergency measures plan, transforming
public buildings into makeshift dormitories equipped with camp cots,
said Penny McMillan, of Tourism Winnipeg.
The airport took in 14 diverted domestic flights and three
international ones -- generating 1,500 overnight guests.
At Vancouver International Airport, Layne Daggett, the airport
chaplain, said he placed 500 people, but others still needed
accommodation.
"I have a strong faith that God is in control even in these kinds of
atrocities," he said.
Column by Margaret Wente, Globe & Mail (Toronto)
By MARGARET WENTE
From Wednesday's Globe and Mail
8:45 a.m., Eastern Daylight Time. A crack in the centre of the world.
Someone took revenge on America, and America was helpless.
Nothing there will ever be the same again.
A nation at the height of power, peace and prosperity, blessed by
every fortune, whose enemies, it seemed, were as harmless as a few
far-off fluffy clouds on a blazing blue September day.
A nation that Tuesday looked infinitely vulnerable.
It only took a few men who hate America to hijack its own commercial
airplanes and turn them into bombs. It only took a few to ram them into
America's most potent symbols of financial and military might.
America's sense of its own security exploded with those towers in a
cloud of smoke and dust.
Americans will never feel quite so safe again. Nor will any of the
rest of us, who looked to them to keep us safe, too.
Their defences were completely useless. Their astounding intelligence
and security machine, fuelled by billions and billions of dollars and
the best high-tech devices ever invented, could not keep the bad guys
out. They slipped through with ease, and struck the nation in its
heart.
The skyline of the capital of the world has a gaping wound where the
towers once stood; a scar that will last forever.
The senseless slaughter of civilians, until now, had always happened
somewhere else. Now the horror has come home.
Who did these things? All indications point to a sacred jihad from the
Middle East. Maybe it was Saddam Hussein, exacting his blood revenge
at last. Or Osama bin Laden, the millionaire fanatic who hates America
for sending troops to Saudi Arabia during the war in the Persian Gulf,
and for supporting Israel. " Blood, blood and destruction, destruction
," he commanded in a videotape to his followers last fall. To kill
Americans is holy.
Those who are responsible are most likely men from remote desert
lands. Men from ancient tribal cultures built on blood and revenge. Men
whose unshakable beliefs and implacable hatreds go back many centuries
farther than the United States and its young ideas of democracy,
pluralism and freedom.
Hard men, who hide out in desert bunkers and turn the instruments of
Western technology — its computers and CD-ROMs and videotapes and
airplanes — against the West. Men capable of flying Boeing 747s with
pinpoint, deadly accuracy, and of giving up their lives for the greater
glory of Allah, and of murder on a massive scale. Men who've mastered
all the modern Western technocratic skills, and who deploy them with
the implacable determination of fanatics.
Men whom most Americans, in their innocent and happy secularism, can
scarcely comprehend and hardly ever gave a thought since that nearly
bloodless cartoon war in the gulf.
That innocence is now gone.
For a decade now, these terrorists have been America's greatest
threat. Its military muscle could have obliterated them long ago, but
the will was never there. The tradeoffs were judged to be too great.
Mr. Hussein and Mr. bin Laden are experts at survival. They are hard to
catch, and surround themselves with men armed with guns and rocket
launchers. Americans would not have been able to stomach too much loss
of life to catch these men and the possibility of failure and political
embarrassment was too great. And no one wanted to create another
Islamic martyr.
Everything will change now, will tip and destabilize in ways far
beyond knowing. The Middle East, the world's economy, the American
intelligence establishment, its entire defence strategy, the way it
fights its foes. Millions of people of Islamic faith unfairly tarnished
by the terrorism of a few.
We have ahead the test by fire of a presidency.
We will have agonizing stories of human suffering, too many to bear.
We will have the dead, and countless families shattered, and grief and
mourning beyond measure.
But the wounds to America, though terrible, are very far from mortal.
"Americans will persevere," said one New York woman Tuesday, staring
hard into the camera. She had seen people die before her eyes. That was
her message to us and to the men who did this.
Shock and disbelief and grief will give way to anger and resolve. The
fanatics and the terrorists will not prevail. The wider Arab world will
not rally to support them, and America will not be driven away.
Americans will persevere.
But everything has changed, and the world will never go back to the
way it used to be, before the madness began, at 8:45 a.m. Eastern
Daylight Time.
BS:
Look, the Boston cell probably lived in Boston.
They've probably been there for years. The government
sheltering them is the American government.
There isn't anybody to invade. They're Egyptians
and Saudis. Thos governments are already our military allies.
We can't invade those countries. There's no place
to dress up and go shoot. This isn't World War II.
As for bin Laden, by the standards of the Islamic
resistance cells, the guy is a *humanitarian.*
He *builds their hospitals.* He's not the mastermind
of Al Qaeda. He's just a public face that the Western media
have projected onto the network. They don't have
or need a mastermind, and nabbing him, while satisfying, won't stop Al
Qaeda any more than nailing Pablo Escobar makes people stop huffing
crack.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 149 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (15:54) * 10 lines
Thanks for the links, Terry. I found the one about the buildings' structural aspects fascinating.
Engineers suggested that the south tower of the World Trade Center collapsed first...because the plane hit the corner of the building, rather than the center, where there is more structural support.
When you watched the head-on film, you wondered why the plane was aimed at the side when it could've been placed more centrally.
But you have to wonder about the following statement:
The planes might have done more damage if they had hit the buildings lower, but they had to fly at a height of about 60 stories to clear nearby buildings.
More damage than what????
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 150 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (19:42) * 1 lines
Even what was left standing is now crumbled into the pit from whence it arose. And thanks for telling future terrorists where exactly to hit a building to do the most damage, media people. I still cannot believe it crumpled like a toy like that. They all did. And so did their inhabitants. I turned on NPR this morning for a break from the news, and they were playing dirges. It was too much! Thanks, all, for your support in what seemed like a cold world before this happened. I wonder what I will feel when the numbness and disbelief wears off...
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 151 of 803: Lucille Oftedahl (alyeska) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (21:40) * 3 lines
Will the numbness ever really wear off.
Someone posted on Ramble that her neighbors and their 2 children were on the plane that crashed into the Pentagon.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 152 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (21:46) * 16 lines
from email:
"In the days and weeks ahead, it's important for Microsoft and for
each of us individually to think about how we can help. As a company,
Microsoft is today making a $10 million contribution to assist those
who have been impacted by the tragedy. We are contributing $5 million
in cash to the September 11 Fund, created by the United Way of New York
City and The New York Community Trust. In addition to cash, we are
also contributing people and expertise. We have committed up to $5
million in technical assistance, including Microsoft Consulting
Services and software to assist in the recovery effort. We also are
in contact with business customers who have been severely impacted by
yesterday's tragedy to see what we can do to assist them."
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 153 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (22:32) * 1 lines
Penn Station and the Empire State Building being evacuated.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 154 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (22:45) * 1 lines
Bomb threat - no bomb found. People allowed back in. They now take all threats seriously!!!
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 155 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (22:50) * 24 lines
Thursday 13 September 9:14 AM
Bin Laden under house arrest: report
Afghanistan's ruling Taliban militia had placed alleged terrorist mastermind Osama bin Laden under house arrest in the wake of the suicide attacks on the United States, an Arabic online newspaper reported.
Quoting "fundamentalist Arab sources", Ilaf said the "Taliban have arrested Osama bin Laden before placing him under surveillance with several of his assistants," including the head of the Egyptian branch of Al-Jihad Ayman Al-Zawahri and bin Laden's military commander, Muhammad Atef Al-Makni.
"A number of Afghan fighters are under house arrest along with bin Laden," said the report late Wednesday.
But a diplomat at the Taliban's embassy in Abu Dhabi said he could not confirm the report.
"All we know is that he (bin Laden) is somewhere in Afghanistan, but we are not aware if he is under house arrest," the diplomat said.
Bin Laden and commander Atef have been indicted for the 1998 bombings of the US embassies in Kenya and Tanzania.
Bin Laden has emerged as the prime suspects in yesterday's kamikaze hijacked passenger jet strikes on New York and Washington.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 156 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (22:53) * 6 lines
I don't know how true this is or not. It was posted on yahoo.com in Australia.
http://au.dailynews.yahoo.com/headlines/20010913/aapworld/1000336445-1141825578.html
I don't know why there's not mention of this on CBS, which I'm watching as I write this.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 157 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (23:06) * 107 lines
More information all over the net.
status of the investigation
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A16714-2001Sep12.html
Flight 93 Passenger Said He Planned Action
http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/pit/news/stories/news-95780920010912-110907.html
Controllers' Tale of Flight 11
http://www.csmonitor.com/earlyed/earlyUSA4.html
FBI Agents Search Hotels; Arrests Made
http://www.thebostonchannel.com/news/957448/detail.html
animation of the routes of flights 11, 193, and 175
http://pull.xmr3.com/p/29594-9681/22024263/aal11.html
http://pull.xmr3.com/p/29594-9681/22024277/ual193final.html
http://pull.xmr3.com/p/29594-9681/22024274/ual175_aal11.html
Somerset Crash Scene Searched; "Hero" May Have Aborted Terror Mission
http://www.post-gazette.com/breaking/20010912somersetp3.asp
Cell Calls From Planes Reveal Horror
http://msnbc.com/news/627214.asp
How the World Trade Center Fell
http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/americas/newsid_1540000/1540044.stm
role of the Internet
Net Offers Lifeline Amid Tragedy
http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1005-200-7132246.html
World Trade Center Staff Sent E-Mails After Planes Struck
http://www.itn.co.uk/news/20010912/business/12cantor.shtml
Help Sites Spring Up in Aftermath of WTC Assaults
http://www.bizreport.com/article.php?art_id=2113
response
Terrorism and Children
http://www.ces.purdue.edu/terrorism/children/
http://www.news.cornell.edu/releases/Sept01/Garbarino.kids.bombing.lgk.html
comment
Chronic Underfunding of US HUMINT Plays Role in Intelligence Failures
http://www.janes.com/security/international_security/news/jdw/jdw010911_1_n.shtml
Michael Moore's commentary
http://www.michaelmoore.com/2001_0912.html
On the Bombings, by Noam Chomsky
http://www.lbbs.org/chomnote.htm
The Best and Worst From Our Leaders During Crises
http://www.workingforchange.com/article.cfm?ItemID=11909
Terrorists Are Made, Not Born
http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2001/09/12/blowback/
The Rhetoric of War
(with examples from editorial pages)
http://www.marginalia.org/war.html
an example of that rhetoric
http://www.nationalreview.com/kudlow/kudlow091101.shtml
background
background on the Mt. Weather bunker where the politicians were probably
taken
http://www.fas.org/nuke/guide/usa/c3i/mt_weather.htm
outline of relevant anti-terrorism etc laws
http://news.findlaw.com/legalnews/us/terrorism/laws.html
Airport Access Control
(one of the security reports that was never properly acted on)
http://cas.faa.gov/ig5.pdf
news
Arab newspapers
http://www.the-saudi.net/arab-world/media/newspapers-links.htm
http://www.amin.org/jourmag/
French language news sources on the attack
http://www.tv5.org/nyc/
Nous Sommes Tous Americains
http://www.lemonde.fr/article/0,5987,3222--221600-,00.html
worldwide news in English
http://www.kidon.com/media-link/english.shtml
Thousands of Newspapers on the Net
http://www.onlinenewspapers.com/
end
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 158 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (23:17) * 1 lines
Be happy you don't live in Hawaii. We Get NO MAIL until the flights resume.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 159 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (23:24) * 1 lines
I'm not going to be happy I don't live in Hawaii, that's too much to ask!
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 160 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (23:31) * 59 lines
a report from Afghanistan:
http://www.nytimes.com/2001/09/13/international/asia/13AFGH.html
ABUL, Afghanistan, Sept. If there are Americans clamoring to bomb Afghanistan back to the Stone Age, they ought to know that this nation does not have so far to go. This is a post-apocalyptic place of felled cities, parched land and downtrodden people.
The fragility of this country was part of the message the Taliban government conveyed in a plea for restraint issued late tonight.
It said in part, "We appeal to the United States not to put Afghanistan into more misery because our people have suffered so much."
Whatever Afghanistan's current cataclysm, its next one seems to require little time to overtake it. Wars fought by sundry protagonists have gone on now for 22 consecutive years, a remorseless drought for 4. Since 1996, most of the nation has been ruled by Taliban mullahs whose vision of the world's purest Islamic state has at least as much to do with controlling social behavior as vouchsafing social welfare.
The accused terrorist Osama bin Laden has found a home here, angering much of the world. In 1998, America fired a volley of more than 70 cruise missiles at guerrilla training camps reportedly operated by the Saudi multimillionaire. Now, there seems to be the prospect of another barrage, with Afghan hospitality to the same man as the cause.
As fear of an American attack mounted, the Taliban's senior spokesman in Kandahar, Abdul Hai Mutmain, called the few foreign reporters here to issue the statement, which in part defended Mr. bin Laden:
"These days, Osama bin Laden's name has become very popular and to an extent it has become a symbol. These days, even to the common people, Osama bin Laden's name is associated with all controversial acts. Osama bin Laden does not have such capabilities. We still hope sanity prevails in the United States. We are confident that if a fair investigation is carried out by American authorities, the Taliban will not be found guilty of involvement in such cowardly acts."
The statement also said, "Killing our leaders will not help our people any. There is no factory in Afghanistan that is worth the price of a single missile fired at us. It will simply increase the mistrust between the people in the region and the United States."
Whatever else there is to say about this entreaty, one part that is indisputably true is that this land-locked, ruggedly beautiful nation is in absolute misery.
Here in Kabul, the capital, roaming clusters of widows beg in the streets, their palms seemingly frozen in a supplicant pose. Withered men pull overloaded carts, their labor less costly than the price of a donkey.
Children play in vast ruins, their limbs sometimes wrenched away by remnant land mines. The national life expectancy, according to the central statistics office, has fallen to 42 for males and 40 for females.
The prolonged drought has sent nearly a million about 5 percent of the on a desperate flight from hunger. Some have gone to other Afghan cities, others across the border. More than one million are "at risk of starvation," according to the United Nations.
Famine is the catastrophe Afghans are used to hearing about. Few yet know of the threat of an American reprisal. The Taliban long ago banned television, and the lack of electricity keeps most people from listening to radio.
The nation's 100 or so foreign aid workers suffer no such telecommunications handicaps, however, and today many of them began to flee their adopted home, fearing either the havoc of American bombs or the wrath of subsequent Afghan outrage.
Around noon, a special United Nations flight evacuated the first of the expatriates. The remaining foreigners are expected to leave on Thursday, as will three, and perhaps all four, of the American parents here to observe the trial of their children, among eight foreign aid workers accused by the Taliban of preaching Christianity.
As foreigners left, the Taliban took unusual precautions: they began searching every vehicle entering government compounds. Visitors were carefully frisked.
But however much the Taliban hierarchy was beginning to fret, streets and bazaars were a picture of normality. Word has spread slowly about the terrorist attacks in New York and Washington. And even when everyday Afghans heard the news, there were no accompanying video images to sear the horror into their memories. Personal conversations only carried the dull stimuli of abstract words: hijacked planes and collapsed buildings.
Khair Khana, a man selling fertilizer in a market, knew just a bit about the attack. He thought a plane had crashed into the White House. And he considered the perpetrators, whoever they are, to be "enemies of God," though he also felt "Americans should look into their hearts and minds about why someone would kill themselves and others" in such a way.
He had not thought much about an American retaliation against Afghanistan. When he did consider it, standing in a ramshackle collection of stalls, he shrugged and said: "Americans are powerful and can do anything they like without us stopping them."
Nearby, a tailor, Abdul Malik, saw God's justice in America's pain because, as he understands it, the United States has armed the Afghan resistance to fight against the Taliban. "So they at least now know how it feels in their own country," he said.
As for Mr. bin Laden, the tailor considered judgment of him to be God's affair. "If Osama is Islam's enemy, he should be gotten rid of," he said. "But if he is a good Muslim and wants Islam to and if America wants him then we hope he destroys America."
The common people of Afghanistan are often circumspect with their opinions. As one man said today: "Nobody here talks wholeheartedly any more; it can be dangerous."
The Taliban are credited with improving safety. They disarmed the population, they put an end to banditry. But the security has come at a steep price.
Women have been forced into head-to-toe gowns known as burqasand evicted from schools and the workplace. Men are obligated to wear long beards or face jail. Banned are musical instruments, chessboards, playing cards, nail polish and neckties. Cheers at soccer matches are restricted to "Allah-u-akbar,"or God is great. Freedom of speech has bowed to religious totalitarianism.
Various Taliban police forces patrol the streets. Today, in a derelict building that is used as a precinct office, one 25-year-old constable sat on the floor beneath a single dangling light bulb. His name was Muhammad Anwar. He had heard something about the attack in America but he had no idea how many were killed or what cities were involved. Indeed, it seemed unlikely that he had ever heard of New York.
"Attacks like these are not a good thing because Muslims live all over the world and Muslims may have been killed," Mr. Anwar said hesitantly. By his reckoning, Americans were enemies of Afghanistan, as were Jews and Christians. He thought about this a bit more and retracted it partially. "There must have been all kinds of people in the building, not just bad Jews but good Jews, not just bad Christians but good ones."
He remembered something he had learned in his madrassa, or religious school. "It is un-Islamic to kill innocent people," he said.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 161 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (23:32) * 1 lines
You're not any different, Marcia. Mail is not going between cities on the mainland either.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 162 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (23:33) * 3 lines
I heard mail wasn't going over 300 miles from it's point of origin.
The airlines carry most of the mail but they may not be allowed to carry it any more.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 163 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (23:35) * 1 lines
Yup, back to barge and 2-week mail. From the west coast. It is nice to know there is company in the misery of Paradise.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 164 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (23:42) * 135 lines
This very thought provoking piece was written by the impassoned Gerard Van der Leun, who has been on the scene all along in
lower Manhattan.
All day the images have repeated themselves on television
while the smell of the smoke persisted in my rooms. Off and
on, all day, I walked to the promenade to look at the reality of it
and watch the smoke that didn't stop. It will now play itself out,
over and over again in my mind, until the day of my own death.
Television and reality. It is very difficult to separate the two,
and when one has no reality, television is the thing that replaces
it.
And because it is through television that those responsible for
this monstrous act receive their impression of this country I
believe they have made a fundamental miscalculation about the
deeper nature of the United States. A miscalculation that will
cause to be visited upon them what I pray will be a terrible
lesson; a lesson that will make the survivors envy the dead.
If you look at television and the endless products of pap and
nonsense that are piped out of the media centers of the United
States, it is easy to see us as a weak, self-obsessed and foolish
people. And many of us are that, even if we pretend to be other
than weak, self-obsessed and foolish.
We have sitcoms and MTV. We have endless opinions about
things which are not really central to serious life questions and
serious policy decisions.
Our young people look foolish in their vanity and their
fashions. Our military institutions are often ridiculed. Our
entertainments are light and vapid. Many in positions of
influence give short shrift to millions more with deeply held
religious and traditional political convictions.
Our "major" issues on a day by day basis rarely rise above the
level of fretful worry about the "safety of restaurants that allow
smoking," or whether or not a flower will be threatened by an
oil well. These are serious issues to many Americans, and it is
easy to see why such wet and weak concerns would lead others
elsewhere in the world to hold us in contempt as a weak and
decadent society that cannot defend itself against attack.
They see our men as feminine and our women as masculine
and, to the fundamentalist mind, this signals a weakness in the
blood and bone of the nation.They believe that they can
attack such a society with a kind of impunity, or with the
expectation of a careful and delicate response. They even note
that our President is a man who communicates in a clumsy
way, who is an illegitimate ruler, and who does not have the
support of many of the ruling elites of the country. They hold
him to be easily frightened and stupid.
And perhaps he is many, if not all, of these things: clumsy,
weak, illegitimate, frightened and stupid.
But it will not, in the long run, matter. And I pray it does not
avail them. That is all the television America.
But there is and always has been another America, and it is this
America that I hope will emerge from this day and remind all
those who seek to harm us that we can be a nation that is as
terrible as it seems foolish. That we are a country of deep
resolve and capable of striking back in cold anger without
compassion or regret. That we are, as the Japanese knew and
were to discover, a sleeping giant and you wake us at your own
risk. And once woken we will destroy you, and then rebuild you.
The Japanese had their lesson and have learned. Germany had
it's lesson and has learned. Now it is the turn of a number
of nations in the middle east.
We will first tend to our dead. Many funerals will take
Place over the next month or so. At the same time we will also
prepare for our vengence and I pray it will be terrible
and without hesitation or compassion until all terrorists
and all the villages, cities, and nations that support
them are reduced to rubble.
This will be an America whose anger is not hidden beneath
grief and the committment to save those not yet dead in
the rubble of New York and Washington.
This is the America you see when you watch the head of the
Fire Department of New York try to express his feelings at
losing 300 men in one terrible moment. This is the America of
the thousands of rescue workers on the job tonight trying to dig
through the rubble. This is the America of terrible resolve that
you can read on the face of the Head of the Joint Chiefs of Staff
when he states the military is ready to do whatever is required
of it. "Whatever is required of it",and I pray we require them to
visit horror on our enemies that is a thousand fold worse than
what we saw today.
You see, it doesn't really matter "who" is the President. It
matters only that there is a President.
The President is only one man and in times like this he does not
really have to lead. He has only to follow and get out of the
way.
After that what takes place will be done by many, many others
in the hundreds and thousands. These people will not be a
group of lame celebrities with their puling little concerns whose
lives are just roles on television. They will not be a host of
sensitive new-age babblers whose fantasies of a perfect world
blind them to the evil of this one and the need to tear it out root
and branch. These will be Americans with terrible tools and with
even more terrible weapons, and the skill and the will to use
them. They will be filled with a terrible intensity and, I hope,
a deep sense of mission which will not be lightly put aside.
This mission should be clear to everyone who has some
experience of the world and how the world operates... how
reality operates. This mission should be nothing less than one
that is willing to use whatever means necessary to target
terrorism and to destroy it, wherever it exists. If this means the
wholesale destruction of nations, so be it.
This mission should be to remind the world that while we are a
nation committed to peace, we are a nation to be feared at war.
We have the power to do this. We must use it without
hindrance. If peace needs to be purchased with the sword, we
should be ready to do this. We must become what we were
during the Second World War - ruthless and unrelenting.
Those who think we are only what they see on our foolish
television, need to have a hard and burning lesson on who we
are when we decide to turn off the sit-coms and get real.
If we cannot do this, we will suffer this again and we will
deserve it. The time to fill ourselves with the resolve to crush
this monster is now and I pray we are up to the task.
Thanks Gerard.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 165 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (23:55) * 192 lines
More from Gerard.
attack.20.430: Gerard Van der Leun (boswell) Tue 11 Sep 01 08:20
I watched this happen. The enormity of it cannot be
communicated.
Vile and bestial.
We need to destroy any and all capacity anywhere to
do anything like this happening ever again.
There were thousands in those buildings. Thousands.
There is no justice swift enough or sure enough.
But all that we have must be brought forward and used
without restraint.
This is an act of war beyond Pearl Harbor.
Military jets overhead again.
More ash on the street.
attack.20.465: Gerard Van der Leun (boswell) Tue 11 Sep 01 08:34
I am cooled down. Way down.,
This is pure evil.
attack.20.725: Gerard Van der Leun (boswell) Tue 11 Sep 01 12:33
There is no more World Trade Center visible
from the Promenade. But you can smell it
from there a sort of burnt stench as if
someone lit newspaper in a trash can and
then poured water on it. That kind of
wet burnt stench.
It is bright in the sunshine now except
for where the Trade Centers stood and there
is still a plume of thick brown smoke
mouldering up from there and making the
sun behind it look dim.
Just now I saw three large military
helicopters land across the river from
the Heights on the big pad at the foot
of Wall Street. People on the streets
are talking quietly man of them on cells
now that some of those nets are back up.
Everything is as quiet as it was this morning
When I got up and began to take a shower.
Showering I felt a vibration shake my building
in Brooklyn Heights like a subway train
passing deep underneath the structure. I didn't
think much of it. I've felt similar vibrations
before.
Getting out I was dressing and I heard the
second explosion from the second plane
striking the buildings.
I turned on the radio and found out what was
happening.
I dressed and left the house and walked a
block to the Promenade at the edge of
Brooklyn Heights and saw both towers in
flames sending huge gouts of smoke into the
air.
You don't know what to think. You don't
know what to feel. You are just reacting. The
promenade was jammed with people with more
arriving.
Then as I watched the first tower just imploded
and plunged, it seemed to me, straight down
and a huge brown and black rolling cloud of
smoke came boiling through all the streets
between the building and surged upward and
took over the sky.
You could see bright shiny bits of metal
squares tumbling up and down and drifting
out of the smoke that moved up and blew out
to the south east... it was like confetti or stuff
tossed out of windows in a ticker tape parade.
I felt the sound before I heard it and it shook
everything around me. I heard gasps and
screams around me. People were turning
away. Everyone with children was leaving the
promenade. Some were moving closer.
The smoke took over everything. I knew that
anyone in that building was dead and I started
to shake and to weep and to look around at the
others who were in all states of reaction. And I
had to go back to my house to regroup.
After I was in the house for a few minutes I
heard another larger explosion. I went back
out and down to the promenade again but this
time I couldn't see the sky as I had before.
This time the whole sky had been darkened
and, the wind having shifted, this fine white
ash was swirling down the street. Not heavy,
but everywhere around me and it was settling
down lightly on all the surfaces.
When I got to the promenade again the entire
southern tip of Manhattan was enveloped in a
dirty brown cloud, No buildings visible at all.
Nothing. It filled the sky and made it dark.
Turning the corner if you looked uptown past
the Brooklyn Bridge which was filled with
hordes of people walking towards the
Brooklyn shore you could see the buildings
start to emerge from the smoke. People were
sparse on the promenade now although down
towards the end there were more and if you
walked down there you could see a little bit
into the downtown section of Wall street. And
there were ferries moving out of the smoke at
high speed.
And then I started to hear the military jets but I
didn't see them. But no other planes are to be
seen.
Now it is still smoking there. The trade centers
are just gone. Erased. 50,000 people they say
work there and 150,000 pass through.
What do I feel? I don't know what I feel
except that I want vengeance and complete
vengeance. I want everything this country
possesses put onto the people who did this,
and the people who supported this act, and the
people who believe this is the way in which
political ends are achieved. I want there to be a
war and a big war until these people are
eradicated who ever they are and where ever
they are. I want it made clear that anything
even approaching this evil act will be met with
utter destruction - people, families, villages,
cities, nations. This is an act of war and war
must be the response.
We will be having a long series of mass funerals
for many weeks. I only hope that this country
finds the stomach and the resolve to carry
retribution forward until it is complete.
That is what I feel, now, today. And I'm not
alone. I'm not alone at all.
attack.20.733: Gerard Van der Leun (boswell) Tue 11 Sep 01 12:42
We need to be in a state of War and to pursue
the real aims of war. Against what country?
Against a list of countries that support, harbor,
or approve of terrorism.
A list of countries. All of them. And we need
to take action that is terrible and unilateral.
Individuals, families, villages, cities, nations..
all must be pursued and eliminated.
There needs to be revenge and there needs to
be a balancing of the scales.
This is the greatest single evil act against
Americans in history.
It cannot be allowed to stand.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 166 of 803: Liz K (ekelley) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (23:55) * 3 lines
that's exactly how I feel.
i found my friend who works for oem, btw. he's ok. he was evacuated when the mayor was from 7 WT. he told me about some of the things he saw... i started to cry. he's still in shock. God bless America.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 167 of 803: Liz K (ekelley) * Wed, Sep 12, 2001 (23:59) * 1 lines
terry, what address are you finding this on??
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 168 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (00:00) * 1 lines
Wow Liz, I'm so glad he's safe. Aren't these words from Gerard pregnant with feeling from someone who's been there, smelled and tasted the horror first hand? Powerful, heartfelt words.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 169 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (00:03) * 92 lines
Gerard posted this at well.com and gave me permission to repost.
It's not on a public web address.
More . . .
Gerard Van der Leun (boswell) Wed 12 Sep 01 08:05
To answer leroy, I am back at my absurd day-job. So far I'm just about
the only one here. Maybe eight people out of 200+.
I don't know quite why I am here, but then, in truth, I'm never sure
why I am ever here other than that my personal life obligations
require me to be here. That may have to change.
At any rate, I woke up and could only take about five minutes of the
endlessly repeated images of disaster, and having, literally nothing
better to do, decided to try and come in.
I first walked to the Promenade to see where the Towers were. The vile
smoke blooming across the river was still there as it has always been,
probably as it always will be in my mind where I will see it first as
that moment when the first tower went down carrying thousands to a
death I cannot imagine.
Still there. And the faint smell lingers too. And there were small
clumps of people standing around, one couple even posing for a picture
against the new skyline.
Then I walked through streets in the Heights that barely had any
people on them. Usually full and bustling even on holiday weekends. Now
just some elderly people moving slowly and a few clots of Jehovahs
Witnesses in their cleaned and pressed clothing going down to put out
what I am sure will be an especially "We told you so" issue of the
Watchtower.
Clark Street station shut down with a few police directly people to
the Jay street station. Buy a New York Post because I've read the
Times. Walk to Jay Street in the heart of the Brooklyn government
center across streets with few pedestrians and no traffic except for
police, fire and security vehicles cruising aimlessly about or parked
at the curb.
Security in front of the courts and the city offices lounging in the
bright sunshine of this second day of Indian Summer weather.
Down into the Jay Station and a very sparsely occupied A train. We set
off on a slow, very slow trip into Manhattan. Several people are
reading bibles but most of the 15 or so people are just staring into
space and looking vaguely alarmed whenever the train halts between
stations -- which is often.
I spend this time reading the New York Post which has, inside, a
picture of the exterior of one of the towers just before it collapsed.
In this picuture I can count around 24 people poking their heads out
of the windows or actually on the outside of what has to be the
nintieth floor of the towers. All of them, ALL OF THEM, about to ride
this building down into oblivion and you know that THEY ALL KNOW THIS.
Next to this is a picture of the side of the Tower and a large empty
space on the left which is thin air. In this space, close to the
tower you can see five to seven people falling with nothing but space
above and below them, falling straight down into doom rather than be
burned alive.
Finally, the train pulls into 23rd Street and halts. After a minute or
so you can hear the announcer telling us that we will be held in the
station for some time because of a "police investigation" in Penn
Station, my destination.
I get out and go up to the street to walk the rest of the way. An I
walk into a Manhattan I have never seen in the almost 30 years that
I've been here. Streets almost utterly clear of traffic for as far
uptown or downtown as you can see on 8th Ave. Nearly the same thing on
7th.
A smattering of pedestrians that grows somewhat thicker as you
approach Penn Station. A nail salon open but with nobody getting their
nails done that I can see.
Extortionate parking lots that are usually jammed with cars almost
empty and with nobody there to collect the money.
On the street parking? Oh, we've got it now.
Everywhere the hush. Everywhere. Like a ghost town with real ghosts
now walking among us. People just standing around, people talking
softly on cell phones, and people talking to themselves. On every
corner small groups walking slowly into the street or ambling along the
sidewalks as if nothing they normally do on Wednesdays in New York
City is really all that important after all.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 170 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (00:05) * 86 lines
Gerard Van der Leun (boswell) Wed 12 Sep 01 19:05
On blood and the giving of it in New York.
It is important to do this, but no longer because of the need.
It is pretty clear at this point in the evening of day 2 in
New York that the city has more than enough of what it needs
to cover for this present emergency.
Still, people should give because it is something than they
can give. That is the need it fills.
As for blood for the wounded and the suffering, there is now
a sufficient quantity.
And sadly this is because, with the exception of a few
miracles that I hope will happen over the next few days,
there will not be large numbers of injured beyond those who
are already receiving treatment.
We are now starting to see the bodies emerge and they will
continue in a ghastly parade of orange body bags for weeks now.
Soon, tomorrow and over the weekend, the funerals and the memorials
will begin. And they will go on and on and on.
We will have, if we are *fortunate* 10,000 funerals in this city
in the coming weeks.
Let me say that again: Ten *thousand* funerals.
Try, right now, to close your eyes and visualize this number of
funeral ceremonies of every type and description and religion.
You cannot do it because the enormity of it is too much for
the human mind and soul.
But we will have them, one by one and in groups.
And here is another fact that comes along behind this number.
We do not have enough graves.
We do not have enough crematoriums.
Many will go unburied for weeks.
Many will be burned because that will be the only
choice.
Many will have to be moved by train, plane, or
van to some other place in the state, country,
or the world.
And we will bury a thousand, and then another thousand, and
another.
And still the orange body bags will come up out of the pile
and the pit one by one by one and lie in rows.
And this will go on for weeks if not months.
Think about what this will be like. Just stop and try
to really see it.
And then think this: No matter what many may feel now about
the wisdom or the goodness or the morality of retribution,
there will come a time during this parade of our dead
when this country, already uniting in a way I cannot remember
in my 55 years, will have even a greater sea-change of
spirit and rage.
Many of those who do not really feel this now, for whatever
enlightened or unenlightened reason, will feel this change
and become part of it.
There will be those who do not, a smaller and smaller part
of us as the days go by, and they will in the end be left
behind.
But by far the most of us will be changed by this, even
if now we are not.
Ten thousand funerals. We cannot imagine it, and yet we will
live it. And I hope that each one of us can bear witness
to as many as we can bear. It is the least of our duties.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 171 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (00:19) * 1 lines
Thanks for that Terry. G's first post is amazing. It says beautifully the resolve and structure of America. Thanks for sharing it.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 172 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (00:29) * 1 lines
And his second one is even more powerful. Beware the wrath of righteous indignation.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 173 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (00:50) * 1 lines
Thank you, Gerard, for speaking so eloquently what we were all feeling. Ten THOUSAND is the size of a good-sized town. Imagine your entire city dead...
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 174 of 803: Beth (Bethanne) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (00:59) * 1 lines
The NY Port Authority is now putting the potential death toll at 20 thousand. I shudder to think what made them increase this up from the earlier figure of 10 thousand. Hopefully, it is just pure conjecture, as the figure of 20 thousand, is just beyond comprehension.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 175 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (01:36) * 15 lines
Never forget!!!
Hawaii was shocked into action by terrorist acts thousands of miles away yesterday, putting
isle military bases on highest alert, grounding air traffic and sending many residents to blood
banks and churches.
U.S. Navy warships were patrolling the West Coast and Hawaii, ready to respond to any
terrorist threat. Lt. Cmdr. Jeff Gordon, a Pacific Fleet spokesman at Pearl Harbor, said the
15 ships patrolling Hawaii waters were deployed or redirected as a precautionary measure,
not because of a specific threat.
Military bases in Hawaii remained closed today to those without military identification for the
second straight day after yesterday's plane hijackings and crashes.
More http://starbulletin.com/2001/09/12/news/
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 176 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (01:43) * 3 lines
Actually, 20,000 was about what I had imagined from the beginning, given the capacity of the two buildings, number of people per floor, etc. Over 200 floors. There could be easily 100 people per floor, despite the steady stream of people getting out after the first attack.
I remember one newsperson saying that highest number of American casualties on a single day was in the Civil War battle of Antietam, where about 23,000 were killed.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 177 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (01:53) * 10 lines
I wonder if we will ever get an accurate accounting. The fires continue to burn deep inside the hole made by one of the towers. It will simply have to burn itself out since it is too hot and too dangerous to get to now. Frightening!
I was asked to post this and so I shall:
Flags Across America
To show those terrorists that we Americans stick together, FRIDAY SEPTEMBER
14 is "Flags Across America." All Americans are asked to display the
American flag either in their homes or cars. Let's keep the meaning of
UNITED in "United States". Pass this onto as many people as you know.
THANK YOU.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 178 of 803: Beth (Bethanne) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (01:58) * 1 lines
I know Karen, I know... When that figure of 10,000 was initially announced, I thought it was too low, considering the massive amounts of people in the 2 towers. But after a trajedy like this, it is easy and comforting to stick your head in the sand and try to pretend the worst is not going to happen. All too soon, the cold hard reality will get to you, no matter how long you try to put it off.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 179 of 803: Anon (curious) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (02:12) * 133 lines
This is YOUR LIFE SUPPORT SYSTEM, a free newsletter
sharing life, love and laughter, published by Steve Goodier.
http://www.lifesupportsystem.com
I asked for it! I invited a response and now am flooded with
mail! It may take days to go through it all. Today I printed some
of YOUR words in lieu of my usual message. I hope you feel
encouraged by the spirit in which they were written. ~ Steve
_________________From the Mailbox__________________
Write to Publisher@LifeSupportSystem.com
I want to express my great condolence to people of America. I
want to say aloud my personal absolute negative expression about
the terrorist attack innocent people in New York and Washington.
Dostoevsky said there are no great goals to justify the crime if
it costs a little tear of child, and how many tears (were shed
by) this outrage act? ~ Your subscriber (Kiev, Ukraine)
Know that the pain and suffering of Americans is also felt
across the mass of water here in Australia. ~ Joanna (Perth,
Australia)
Let those of us who can, hold a vision of peace, even between
ourselves and those who would destroy us. Let those of us who
can see the Light, be the Light. ~ A friend
Everything came to a standstill here (South Africa) yesterday
afternoon at about 3.00 p.m. our time when we first heard the
news of the horror! What I do want to say, from our small space,
far away from you all in America, is that we grieve for the whole
nation and all of you are in our prayers and thoughts --
constantly. ~ Caroline (South Africa)
The Canadian People Send Their Deepest Condolences to Our
American Friends. We are shocked and horrified, as most Americans
are, as soon as we heard the news many rallied, giving blood to
the Canadian Red Cross in anticipation of the need by those that
might need it. America is our fiend and neighbour, and those that
hurt America hurt us. We hope that we never see another tragedy
as this again. ~ Doug (Canada)
Thank you! Even with all that you and your family have been
going through, you have still managed to send inspiration to
those of us in need! With all of the negativity out there
yesterday, and the "Nuke 'EM" attitude among a lot of Americans
that called into CNN and the radio stations here in Chicago, I
began to find myself getting more upset about them than the
tragedy that caused their feelings. Thank you for reminding the
many people who forget in times like this that we are all one --
most humans do NOT believe that the killing of innocents is
right, no matter what race! Here in Chicago, an Arab education
meeting was hit with a molotov cocktail -- this is exactly what
we DON'T need! Thanks again for your call to Americans to see the
truth and work through our grief with LOVE! ~ Kelli (Chicago,
Illinois)
I, like so many of us in the US, live complacently from day
to day without fear of danger. Then a tragedy like this occurs
and reminds us of the fragility of life and how important it is
for us to set aside our differences and all join hands in common
bond. ~ Mal (Pasadena, Texas, USA)
I live in Barbados, a small island in the West Indies
(Caribbean). The tragedy of yesterday shook us here as well. My
thoughts and prayers go out to everyone in the States. May God
continue to strengthen your nation and be with every one of your
leaders as they make decisions and try to rebuild the country. ~
Marie (Barbados)
A great gloom has descended on Australia today and will
remain for a while to come. The streets were empty in peak hour
this morning as people stayed home to watch in horror as the
event was broadcast across the nation. And this gloom has
remained the whole day, with the attack being just about the only
thing on peoples minds. America is far from alone in its hurt and
sorrow and we will do whatever we can to help our fellow humans.
~ Nikki (Gold Coast, Australia)
I hope that from yesterday events we may learn at least one
lesson: that hate only brings violence and destruction. "Love
thy enemy" was not written in vain. I pray that the hurt we all
feel today does not develop into hate and desire for revenge. ~
Olga (Puerto Rico, USA)
My thoughts from South Africa are with you in this dark hour.
But I know that you are a country of strong people. People that
will support each other and together stand up to become even
stronger. ~ Ronelle (Gauteng, South Africa)
I am thankful to you always for the positive, uplifting
words. I look forward to my daily emails. I never needed them
more than I needed them today. I was one of hundreds in Jersey
City, at Exchange Place, who watched this event unfold to our
shock, horror and disbelief. Thanks for giving me something to
hold on to. ~ TL
Everything has changed today. Our nation, our world, our
civilization. If we are not extremely careful, we could surrender
our future to these terrorists in exchange for the perception of
peace and security. The terrorists demonstrated that the United
States is a free and open country. We have paid a price for
having an accessible society. Accessible to all, for whatever
purpose they desire. Accessible for good or evil. ~ Eric
I light a candle that is burning as a vigil in my home
reminding me that Light overcomes darkness. I fly the American
flag outside my home at half mast. I turn my headlights on my car
to light the way, in my way, for those who feel lost right now. ~ Y.M.
Many leaders interviewed on TV have already been
saying, if we as mankind would unite during times of
peace as we do in tragedy, then we will be able to
remove all bad things, including hunger, homelessness,
and despair. That is a proactive point of view. ~ Randy
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Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 180 of 803: Allison M (Allison2) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (03:43) * 1 lines
In addition to thousands of Americans killed they are now saying there were hundreds of UK citizens. My son (he works for a US bank in London) has just got back from spending a week working in NY. He was in the WTC every day. The world really is a global village. What happens to the US happens to us all.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 181 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (08:37) * 3 lines
http://tibet.com/NewsRoom/hhdl-letter.htm
The Dalai Lama speaks.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 182 of 803: Moon Dreams (Moon) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (09:05) * 5 lines
The world really is a global village. What happens to the US happens to us all.
Let's hope this unity works in the hard task ahead.
There are some flights flying into Miami. They seem to be flying lower than usual. Where once we could barely hear them now they are very loud. Very scary. :-(
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 183 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (09:47) * 1 lines
Thank goodness that your family was spared, Allison. I was thinking about Ben's brother. Isn't he in NYC and probably in that part of it?
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 184 of 803: MarkG (MarkG) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (09:55) * 1 lines
Ben's brother works (I believe) for Morgan Stanley, who have (had) 21 floors of the South WTC tower, although it's not their head office in NYC. MS reported yesterday that over 85% (and growing) of their WTC staff had survived. So his odds are good.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 185 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (10:08) * 1 lines
Thanks, Mark, for the update. The other night I was watching BBC news' coverage on one of my PBS channels and they were talking about all the foreign nationals who worked in the financial sector.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 186 of 803: MarkG (MarkG) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (10:23) * 5 lines
That's right, Karen. Just like here in London, the NYC financial services industry is one of the most multi-national workforces around. Obviously, the BBC is concerned to take some time focusing on the number of Britons involved, but there will be many nationalities amongst the dead, along with the thousands of Americans.
A colleague of mine reports that his NY counterpart works in a suburb in which nearly everybody commutes to Manhattan. Every few doors down the street there was a worker who never came home on Tuesday.
Personally, three of my four previous firms had offices in the WTC. It brings the tragedy close to home, but not as close as for the family members and friends of the 20,000.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 187 of 803: Eileen (EileenG) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (10:58) * 7 lines
(Mark) MS reported yesterday that over 85% (and growing) of their WTC staff had survived. So his odds are good.
Yes, I heard that about MS also. They credit a 'split second decision to evacuate' after the first plane hit the other tower. It seems to me alot more people got out than you might expect (credit the '93 bombing for that). Yet the stories of those searching for their loved ones, who called before 9 a.m. to say they were OK but who worked above the 90th floor, are absolutely heartbreaking. This will continue for weeks.
(Beth) The White House and ABC News have confirmed that the intended target of the plane that crashed in DC, was NOT The Pentagon. It was The White House.
OMG !! The White House have also confirmed that Air Force One and The President, were also intended targets. They have not revealed what brought them to this
conclusion.
I'll tell you--this is spin. Georgie's being criticized for not returning to DC until late afternoon. The plane which hit the Pentagon, the press sec'y says, circled over the White House first. They may have more 'clear and convincing' evidence that the White House and Air Force One (a plane? They're going to hit a plane with a plane with so many other gov't targets around? George was on the ground in Fla. at the time of the attacks) were targeted, but I'm not biting. Though they could've indeed gone for the White House and done far more damage to the country--Dick Cheney was at his desk. ;-P
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 188 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (11:01) * 15 lines
On Doomed Flight, Passengers Vowed to Perish Fighting
By JODI WILGORENand EDWARD WONG
They told the people they loved that they would die fighting.
In a series of cellular telephone calls to their wives, two passengers
aboard the plane that crashed into a Pennsylvania field instead of
possibly toppling a national landmark learned about the horror of the
World Trade Center. From 35,000 feet, they relayed harrowing details
about the hijacking in progress to the police. And they vowed to try to
thwart the enemy, to prevent others from dying even if they could not
save themselves.
More:
http://www.nytimes.com/2001/09/13/national/13NEWA.html
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 189 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (11:04) * 114 lines
Austin's Stratfor.com intelligence reports are some of the best:
Situation Reports
European markets stabilized in trading Sept. 12, helping to calm the major Asian markets entering the trading day Sept. 13. AFP reports that Tokyo, Hong Kong, Sydney and South Korea all posted minor gains after steep losses the previous day, though all markets remain fairly below pre-attack levels. Singapore dropped marginally, and Malaysia, Thailand and Taiwan -- which were closed Sept. 13 -- posted losses of between 4 and 7 percent. 1519 GMT, 091301
The Afghanistan opposition Northern Alliance, which opposes the ruling Taliban, has appointed a new military chief to replace leader Ahmad Shah Masood, Reuters reported. Masood was replaced with a general named Mukhammad Fakhim on Sep. 11, a few days after Masood was wounded in an attack. Conflicting reports have stated that Masood was actually killed in the attack. 1501 GMT, 091301
The Washington Post reports that the Bush administration is continuing to gather support for a possible strike against Saudi dissident Osama bin Laden and his supporters in Afghanistan, pressuring neighboring Pakistan for intelligence and logistical backing after winning full NATO support Sept. 12. Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf has pledged his country's full cooperation in the probe into the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks in the United States, VOA news reported, while Saudi Arabia has also reportedly offered its support. The Chinese government is appealing to the United States to consult with countries beyond Europe before launching an attack, BBC reported. 1430 GMT, 091301
Fox News reports that almost all of the hijackers involved in the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks have been identified on flight manifests, including many Saudi and Egyptian nationals and one known supporter of Saudi dissident Osama bin Laden, considered a prime suspect in the attacks. The news agency, citing law enforcement officials, said that a flight manifest from one of the four flights included the name of a suspected bin Laden supporter, while one person has also been arrested in connection with the attacks in Hamburg, Germany. 1427 GMT, 091301
U.S. authorities said at least one hijacker on each of the four planes used in the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks was trained at a U.S. flight school, AP reported. Overall, 50 people may have been involved in the operation. Attorney General John Ashcroft said 12 to 24 hijackers commandeered the four planes, and a government official said another two dozen or so are believed to have assisted them, AP reported. The Los Angeles Times reports that about 40 of the men have been accounted for, including those killed in the suicide attacks, but 10 remain at large. The Times also reported at least one of the suspects receiving advanced flight training in Florida was a commercial pilot from Saudi Arabia. 1417 GMT, 091301
The Associated Press reports that a former employee at Huffman Aviation school in Venice Venice, Fla., said FBI agents told him that Mohamed Atta, who stayed in his home while training at the local flight school, was involved in the attack on the World Trade Center Sept. 11. The Miami Herald, citing federal authorities, reports that Atta was one of four suspects who died on American Airlines Flight 11, the first jetliner to crash into the center. A second student at Huffman Aviation, identified as Marwan Alshehhi, is also a suspect. 1410 GMT, 091301
Afghanistan's ruling Taliban Sept. 13 dismissed reports linking Osama bin Laden to terrorist attacks on the United States earlier on the week, and reiterated that they would not hand over the Saudi dissident, AFP reported. Reports had surfaced the previous day claiming that the Taliban had arrested bin Laden. The Taliban is reportedly preparing for a possible U.S. attack, sending its top leader into hiding and repositioning its military hardware throughout the country, The Washington Post reported, citing reports from Pakistani intelligence sources.1405 GMT, 091301
Federal aviation officials said they would allow air travel in the United States to resume Sept. 13 morning. U.S. Attorney General John Ashcroft said authorities were deploying hundreds of U.S. marshals and other agents to airports and airplanes to increase security with the gradual resumption of commercial flights, AP reported. 1400 GMT, 091301
The Times of India has published a report originally carried by an Arabic online newspaper, saying that the Taliban has placed Saudi dissident Osama bin Laden and several of his assistants under house arrest in Afghanistan. A diplomat at the Taliban embassy in Abu Dhabi could not confirm the report. 2318 GMT, 091201
Armed sky marshalls and/or company security officials will accompany flights in the United States for at least a short period of time, possibly indefinitely, according to airline industry officials and the Department of Transportation. 2240 GMT, 091201
Deputy Secretary of State Richard Armitage told Pakistani Ambassador Maleeha Lodhi Sept. 12 that the United States expects full Pakistani cooperation on the search for perpetrators of Sept. 11 attacks on the United States, AFP reported. Secretary of State Colin Powell told reporters, "We thought … it would be useful to point out to the Pakistani leadership at every level that we are looking for and expecting their fullest cooperation and their help and support." Washington is concerned about Pakistan's relationship with Afghanistan's Taliban, which is suspected of harboring Osama bin Laden. Pakistan is one of only three countries worldwide that officially recognize the Taliban. 2355 GMT, 091201
Israeli intelligence officials briefing the Prime Minister Ariel Sharon's cabinet Sept. 12 reported that a Middle East government likely sponsored the attack on the United States. They also identified Iraq as the most likely candidate, according to the Middle East News Line (MENL). The news report speculates that Iraq may have financed the operation and recruited Osama bin Laden, stating that Iraq maintains an alliance with bin Laden and radical Islamic groups. 2207 GMT, 091201
NATO's emergency council declared in a statement Sept. 12 that the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks on the United States fall under the alliance's mutual defense arrangements. This is the first-ever invocation of Article V of the North Atlantic Treaty, which calls for joint action in response to an attack on one alliance member. 2152 GMT, 091201
United Arab Emirates state TV reported Sept. 12 that two men identified by U.S. authorities as possible suspects in the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks were carrying Saudi passports, AFP reports. The two suspects, Wa'el Mohammad al-Shihri and Ahmad Ibrahim Ali al-Hazzouni, reportedly carried international drivers licenses issued by the UAE and had rented a car which was later seized at Boston's Logan airport. 2150 GMT, 091201
The FAA announced late Wednesday afternoon that passenger air travel will resume temporarily to allow stranded travelers who were diverted Sept. 11 to reach their destinations. The partial opening will occur under heavily-intensified security precautions. The FAA said that it is not yet resuming normal operations due to continued security concerns. 2115 GMT, 091201
The Russian Foreign Ministry said Sept. 12 that Moscow and the European Union plan to step up cooperation to fight international terrorism follow the Sept. 11 attacks in the United States, AFP reported. 1935 GMT, 091201
U.S. Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan has asked central banks to limit the trading in dollars to prevent shocks to the global currency markets, CNNfn reported. The Fed is concerned that a large dollar transaction could create dangerous ripples and harm liquidity. As of Wednesday afternoon, the dollar was bouncing back from earlier losses, stabilizing at 119.38 yen to the dollar and .9067 dollars to the Euro, while trading was thin, AFP reported. Greenspan is due to return from Europe later today. 1935 GMT, 091201
Reacting to the terrorist attacks on New York and Washington, Lebanese Information Minister Ghazi Aridi cautioned against "impulsive" accusations and suggested that the United States should reconsider some international policies that have earned it enemies, the Lebanese Daily Star reported. "There's a need for re-examining the 'New World Order' and the proposed globalization. There's a need for more cooperation and for building relations based on the respect for the rights of people and a just distribution of wealth, not the logic of force," Aridi said. 1935 GMT, 091201
In a national television address, Russian President Vladimir Putin called Sept. 12. for coordinated international action to combat terrorism, which he called the "plague of the 21st century," Agence France-Presse reported. He cited the 1999 bombings of apartment buildings in Moscow in condemning the attacks on New York and Washington. National news agency Interfax quoted Putin in a telegram to Bush as saying, "There is no doubt that such inhuman acts must be punished." Interfax also reported that Russia placed its national air defenses on full alert and that "anti- terrorism measures" were being enforced nationwide. 1935 GMT, 091201
A spokesman for British Prime Minister Tony Blair said Sept. 12 that the number of Britons who died in the Sept. 11 terrorist attack in the United States "could run into hundreds," AFP reported. 1930 GMT, 091201
In a statement Sept. 12 Taliban authorities offered to negotiate about the future of Saudi dissident Osama bin Laden if the United States could provide proof of his involvement in the recent terrorist attack on the United States, Kyodo News Service reported, although the group has made similar statements in the past. Reuters reports that the Taliban has beefed up security at government offices and closed the main airport in Kabul after it endured a rocket attack by anti-Taliban forces overnight. 1927 GMT, 091201
Kyodo News Service reports that the United Nations evacuation from Afghanistan will be completed Sept. 14, and will include a large number of foreign aid workers. CNN reported that U.N. staff were taking unusual measures such as taking key documents and computer discs with them. 1852 GMT, 091201
European stock markets strengthened somewhat despite the terrorist attacks on the United States Sept. 11, MSNBC reported. London's FTSE 100 INDEX closed 134.80 points higher at 4,880.80, or up about 2.8 percent, late Sept. 12. The Paris CAC 40 index closed 54.51 points higher at 4,114.26, up 1.34 percent. Frankfurt's DAX was up around 85 points, or 2 percent higher, at 4,358 in late-afternoon trading. 1850 GMT, 091201
Iraqi President Saddam Hussein said Sept. 12 that the United States was "reaping the thorns" of its foreign policy, in a commentary quoted by the official INA news agency on the terrorist attacks the previous day in New York and Washington. 1810 GMT, 091201
A plan to hijack commercial planes and fly them into U.S. targets was reportedly incorporated into a terror strategy by Ramzi Zhmed Yousef, who was sentenced to life imprisonment for masterminding the bombing of the World Trade Center in 1993, Inquirer News Service reported. The plan was first uncovered in Manila in 1995 after police arrested four suspects in a plot to assassinate Pope John Paul II, and was passed on to U.S. officials by the Philippine government. At least four of Yousef's partners in the 1993 bombing have remained at large, increasing suspicions that they could be involved in the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks in New York and Washington, D.C. 1758 GMT, 091201
The European Union is ramping up its own internal security measures for public transportation, airlines and around public buildings, Reuters reports, while Europol has set up a special task force for police agencies to exchange terrorism information. 1755 GMT, 091201
NATO ambassadors opened a debate Sept. 12 into whether terrorist attacks in New York and Washington represented an "armed attack" against the entire 19-nation alliance, AFP reported. If NATO nations agree on such a stance, the alliance could take "such action as it deems necessary, including the use of armed force, to restore and maintain the security of the North Atlantic area." 1735 GMT, 091201
Citing its already fragile financial situation, as well as the impact of the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks, Midway Air has suspended its operations and laid off 1,700 workers, AP reported. In a statement the company said "demand for air transportation is expected to decline sharply." 1734 GMT, 091201
CNN reports that FBI agents have taken several people in Boston and southern Florida into custody for questioning about the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks on The World Trade Center and the Pentagon. The FBI is not calling them "suspects", but it does say they may provide material information on the case. Activity in Boston is centered around the Westin Copley Hotel and includes Boston police and SWAT teams. CNN reports that investigations in Florida are focusing their attention on several flight schools. 1720 GMT, 091201
CNN reports that the FBI has identified several suspects in the Boston area thought to be involved in the Sept. 11 hijackings and terrorist attacks in New York and Washington, D.C. The report was attributed to a "usually reliable" Boston television station but has not been confirmed by the FBI. 1708 GMT, 091201
The Jerusalem Post reports that Israel has put its air force and anti-aircraft batteries on increased alert and increased the number of its airborne patrols over Israeli airspace. The measures were taken to prevent any unwanted infiltration, air force sources said. Defense forces say no further significant security measures are being taken, as the country was already on a high alert status due to recent terrorist attacks. 1706 GMT, 091201
The Federal Aviation Authority said today that the ban on all U.S. air travel, originally set to end at noon Sept. 12, has been extended indefinitely, National Public Radio reported. The Pentagon is also reportedly being evacuated for a second day in a row. Parts of the Pentagon near the initial impact by a commercial airliner Sept. 11 are becoming increasingly insecure and there are concerns of further collapse, CNN reported. The secretaries of the U.S. Army and Navy have been moved to the building's basement. 1620 GMT, 091201
Ha'aretz reports that Israel reopened its airspace to foreign airline traffic today, though foreign flights must still gain special security clearance before landing. Israeli airspace was closed Sept. 12 due to concerns that the country could be targeted for attacks like those in New York and Washington, D.C. 1631 GMT, 091201
Israeli Defense Forces have ramped up attacks in the territories, The Jerusalem Post reported, saying 10 Palestinians were killed and over 30 wounded in overnight and morning attacks in the West Bank and Gaza Strip, following the terrorist attacks in New York and Washington, D.C. Israeli tanks moved into the West Bank city of Jenin early on Sept. 12 and reportedly destroyed a Palestinian security headquarters and two suspected terrorist hideouts before withdrawing. 1635 GMT, 091201
The Taliban said Sept. 12 that any retaliatory strikes by the United States on Afghanistan and on Saudi dissident Osama bin Laden, the prime suspect in the Sept. 11 attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, would fail and that Washington would not be able to find any person it targets, AFP reported, citing a Taliban spokesman. Bin Laden is living in Afghanistan under the Taliban militia's protection. The United Nations has ordered all 80 of its employees out of Afghanistan. 1553 GMT, 091101
Saudi dissident Osama bin Laden Sept. 12 congratulated the people who carried out the terrorist attacks in New York and Washington, D.C., but denied that he was involved, AP reported, citing Abu Dhabi Television's bureau chief in Islamabad. U.S. Embassies in Yemen, Kuwait and Oman and the United Arab Emirates announced that they are closing indefinitely. 1333 GMT, 091201
The FBI has reportedly identified five suspects in connection with the Sept. 11 attacks on the World Trade Center and Pentagon, ABC news reported, citing Boston Herald report. Investigators are searching Boston’s Logan’s airport, where two of the hijacked planes used in the assault originated, and reportedly believe two of the suspects flew from Portland, Maine, to Logan before the attack. 1328 GMT, 091201
Fox News, citing the Boston Herald, reported that two of the suspects so far identified in the search of Logan airport were brothers, one of whom was a trained pilot, and had passports traced to the United Arab Emirates. Reuters though quoted a UAE government source who said there is no evidence that any emirate nationals were aboard the hijacked planes. The Boston Globe reported that one of the five suspects’ bags did not make the connection to the plane that was hijacked, and the luggage contained a copy of the Koran, an instructional video on flying commercial airliners and a fuel consumption calculator. The FBI also towed from the airport’s parking garage a rental car with a Virginia license plate that contained Arabic-language flight training manuals, ABC reported. 1325 GMT, 091201
Federal agents are planning to serve search warrants on a home or homes in south Florida of a passengers believed to be on one of the hijacked commercial planes used in the Sept. 11 attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, Reuters reported, citing a local television channel report. The station gave no further details of the planned search other than saying it would focus on Davie, a city about 20 miles northwest of Miami, while the FBI was not available to confirm or deny. Fox News reported that at least one Middle Eastern student at flight school Embry-Riddle University in Daytona Beach, Fla., is missing, and that authorities are looking into reports he may have been on one of the hijacked planes. 1320 GMT, 091201
U.S. Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld said Sept. 11 that there is “no way” that the United States was involved in bombings reported in Afghanistan ’s capital Kabul. U.S. President George W. Bush also arrived back at the White House Sept. 11 after shuttling during the day between air force bases in Louisiana and Nebraska. 2257 GMT, 091101
Explosions around Kabul do not appear to be the result of U.S. action, despite speculation that that Saudi militant Osama bin Laden, who shelters in Afghanistan, was behind today's terrorist strikes in New York and Washington. Rather, Afghanistan's ruling Taliban militia Sept. 12 launched a massive attack against opposition Northern Alliance forces north of the city. The attack follows allegations that Northern Alliance commander Ahmad Shah Masood died of injuries he received in an assassination attempt Sept. 10. Taliban and Northern Alliance forces have been winding up the summer fighting season over the past few weeks with extensive clashes north of Kabul, and in the northern province of Takhar. 2240 GMT, 091101
CNN showed footage of Afghanistan's capital Kabul under attack early Sept. 12, with explosions and anti-aircraft fire seen throughout the city. Numerous missiles were also seen heading to the city’s airport. The fighting is most likely the result of continued fighting between the opposition Northern Alliance and the ruling Taliban. 2211 GMT, 091101
The New York Stock Exchange has delayed trading indefinitely after the World Trade Center collapsed Sept. 12 following a terrorist attack. The Federal Reserve also announced it is ready to provide additional money to banks if needed. 2142 GMT, 091101
Air Security International has reported that Air Force One has left the Offutt Air Force Base in Nebraska and is heading toward Washington, D.C. It also reports that subsidiary building 7 of the World Trade Center has collapsed and that building 5 may follow. AP also reported that the plane that struck the Pentagon was an American Airlines jetliner that had taken off from Dulles International Airport, and that officials say one of the passengers was Barbara Olson, the wife of Solicitor General Theodore Olson, who argues U.S. President George W. Bush's cases before the Supreme Court.
2116 GMT, 091101
Britain, Washington's closest ally, put its security forces on maximum alert Sept. 11 following terrorist attacks in New York and Washington, D.C, AFP reported. All U.S. military forces around the world are also now on Threat Condition Delta, the highest state of alert under the new system. 2123 GMT, 091101
Israel has closed its borders with Egypt and Jordan following the terrorist attacks in New York and Washington, D.C., Sept. 11, Israeli public television reported. Israel earlier closed its airspace for 24 hours to incoming foreign aircraft, and its air force has been placed on high alert. U.S. authorities also boosted surveillance around the U.S. base in Incirlik, southern Turkey, but a spokesman would not specify the level of alert to which troops at the base were posted, AFP reported. The base holds a force of some 40 British and U.S. planes which patrol the no-fly zone over northern Iraq. NATO ambassadors are scheduled to meet in Brussels, while European Union foreign ministers are due to meet early Sept. 12. 2052 GMT, 091101
Fox News is citing a Middle East Broadcasting report which said the Democratic Front for the Liberation of Palestine is now denying involvement in today’s attacks in New York and Washington, D.C., despite earlier reports which said the group had claimed responsibility. Two other Palestinian groups, Hamas and the Islamic Jihad, also denied responsibility for the attacks, but blamed U.S. policies in the Mideast, CNN reported. Despite earlier denials by the Taliban, CNN also said government sources have good indications that those involved in the attacks have links to suspected Saudi terrorist Osama bin Laden, although no details were given. 2002 GMT, 091101
The Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries pledged Sept. 11 to maintain a stable oil supply following a rise in oil prices after the terrorist attacks in New York and Washington, Kyodo news agency reported. OPEC Secretary-General Ali Rodriquez Araque said member nations will guarantee a sufficient supply of crude oil and are also prepared to use their excess production capability to maintain a stable supply. 1951 GMT, 091101
Fox News is reporting that the commercial airline that crashed into the Pentagon Sept. 11 was American Airlines Flight 77 en route from Dulles Airport in Virginia to Los Angeles. There were 58 passengers, four flight attendants and two pilots on board. A Fox News commentator was on the plane and reportedly made a call from her cell phone, officials said. Fox also cited United Airlines pilots who said UA Flight 175 was the second plane that crashed into the World Trade Center. The Boeing 767 carried 56 passengers, two pilots and seven flight attendants. 1942 GMT, 091101
Sources say that U.S. President George W. Bush has landed at Offutt Air Force Base in Omaha, Nebraska, center of the Strategic Air Command, after leaving from Louisiana, local radio reported. Fox News also reports that Marine amphibious units are being deployed to Washington, D.C. 1935 GMT, 091101
Fox News is reporting that a U.S. judge last June had set Sept. 12 as the sentencing date for an associate of suspected Saudi terrorist Osama bin Laden for his role in the 1998 bombing of a U.S. embassy in Tanzania. The sentencing had been set for the federal courthouse near the World Trade Center, which was destroyed Sept. 11 after being hit by two commercial airliners. Fox is also reporting that a 911 dispatcher in Westmoreland County, Pa., received a cell phone call from a man who said he was a passenger locked in the bathroom of the United Airlines flight which crashed outside of Pittsburgh. The passenger reportedly said the plane was being hijacked. 1909 GMT, 091101
Reuters is reporting that Arabic satellite television channel MBC warned Sept. 8 that followers of suspected Saudi terrorist Osama bin Laden were planning a major attack on U.S. and Israeli interests in the next two weeks. Israeli Defense Minister Benjamin Ben-Eliezer also warned Sept. 10, the day before attacks on U.S. targets in New York and Washington, that "a coalition has been formed recently between terror organizations, Palestinians, Shiites and bin Laden operating against Israeli, American and European targets.” 1850 GMT, 091101
U.S. President George W. Bush will leave Barksdale Air Force Base in Louisiana for an undisclosed location, Reuters reported Sept. 11, citing a White House official. All airports in the United States have also been closed by order of the Federal Aviation Administration, the first time in U.S. history that air traffic nationwide has been halted, while all U.S. financial markets were closed as well, Fox news reported. 1838 GMT, 091101
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 190 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (11:05) * 7 lines
Koppel said a Pakistani news agency quoted the taliban saying they do not
have Bin Laden under house arrest or any other kind.
Frontline is going to show an updated version of their documentary on Bin
Laden on thursday. They also have an extensive website
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/binladen/
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 191 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (11:05) * 6 lines
The LA Times has a detailed story
FBI Identifies Team of 50 Attackers
http://latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-091301terror.story
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 192 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (11:16) * 2 lines
(Eileen) I'll tell you--this is spin. Georgie's being criticized for not returning to DC until late afternoon.
I thought the same thing and said so to Ev last night. Bush was in Florida. Symbolically they might have wanted to hit the White House, but this is a crock to deflect newspapers' criticism. Unfortunately, most Americans do not realize that getting key government functions, including the President, to safety means taking them out of Washington and into bunkers and I'm sure the disaster scenarios for the presidency would involve moving him around. The hijackers wouldn't even have known he eventually went up in Air Force One or where it was headed. Totally idiotic. I bet we never see this 'credible' evidence.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 193 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (11:20) * 10 lines
http://www.rand.org/hot/newslinks.html#terror
This is the URL for a Rand report on the state of U.S. anti-terrorism
policy as of 2000. Executive summary: we don't have one.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/binladen/
This is a joint PBS/NYT site on bin Laden, dating from a little after
the first WTC bombings.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 194 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (11:30) * 15 lines
The die has been cast. The lead story in the Thursday edition of the
Washington Post is a detailed description of US negotiations with
Pakistan and Tajikstan to provide a staging area or at least safe
passage for a mission to track down Osama Bin Laden in Afghanistan.
www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A20862-2001Sep12.html
The second story starts by saying that Pentagon officials are keeping
a tight lid on deployments and planning options, then proceeds to
spill the beans extravagantly about the range of plans and preparations
in progress for the effort to find and deal with Osama Bin Laden.
www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A20806-2001Sep12.html
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 195 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (11:31) * 3 lines
Plans underway for massive invasion of Afghanistan:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/wtccrash/story/0,1300,551079,00.html
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 196 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (11:37) * 2 lines
A wired story reports that FBI agents are busy installing carnivore on ISPs
http://www.wired.com/news/politics/0,1283,46747,00.html
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 197 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (11:38) * 13 lines
Anti-Attack Feds Push Carnivore
By Declan McCullagh
2:00 a.m. Sep. 12, 2001 PDT
WASHINGTON -- Federal police are reportedly increasing Internet surveillance after Tuesday's deadly attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon.
Just hours after three airplanes smashed into the buildings in what some U.S. legislators have dubbed a second Pearl Harbor, FBI agents began to visit Web-based, e-mail firms and network providers, according to engineers at those companies who spoke on condition of anonymity.
An administrator at one major network service provider said that FBI agents showed up at his workplace on Tuesday "with a couple of Carnivores, requesting permission to place them in our core, along with offers to actually pay for circuits and costs."
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 198 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (11:44) * 0 lines
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 199 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (11:48) * 4 lines
From the Guardian article:
Nato is now drawing up an emergency plan for a massive attack on Afghanistan if proof emerges that Osama bin Laden, the wanted Saudi-born terrorist sheltered by Afghanistan, was responsible for the attacks.
What do they mean by if? A signatory to a treaty is a signatory to a treaty. Also, they are making it sound like it's an obscure passage of the treaty. That it hasn't been invoked isn't relevant IMO. It is the backbone of the NATO alliance. Only the enemy has changed.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 200 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (12:14) * 4 lines
http://www.janes.com/security/international_security/news/misc/janes010911_2_n.shtml
The hunt for Bin Laden begins.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 201 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (12:15) * 11 lines
According to NYPD radio scan police are reporting that Grand Central Station
is right now being evacuated and strett traffic has been closed off in the
last 10 minutes in that area. there were reports that a transit officer was
approached by two passengers that a male dressed in tan was seen with a
backpack with wires coming out of it and something attached around his
waist. Police have not as of this minute located any peson matching this
description. Now the report is that the package or backpack was left on a
train from Greenwich, and that the terminal is completely evacuated.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 202 of 803: Mari (mari) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (12:31) * 10 lines
(Eileen)Though they could've indeed gone for the White House and done far more damage to the country--Dick Cheney was at his desk. ;-P
Oh Eileen, I am laughing in spite of myself, one of the few good laughs in days. Agree that it's spin, but who cares?
The fragility of this country was part of the message the Taliban government conveyed in a plea for restraint issued late tonight.
It said in part, "We appeal to the United States not to put Afghanistan into more misery because our people have suffered so much."
They should have thought of this before they harbored and supported terrorists. And at whose hands have they suffered? They are asking us to show more caring for their people than they themselves have. And this culpability doesn't stop at the Afghan border.
I really wonder if the world has the resolve and stomach to do what needs to be done in order to protect and preserve the greater good.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 203 of 803: Moon Dreams (Moon) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (12:56) * 4 lines
I really wonder if the world has the resolve and stomach to do what needs to be done in order to protect and preserve the greater good.
We have lost some of our freedom. It will never be the same.
In Miami one of the thoughts is that Castro might have supported these terrorists. Could you imagine also going after Castro? That would put Miami at a very high risk for attacks.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 204 of 803: Eileen (EileenG) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (13:22) * 7 lines
(Mari) Agree that it's spin, but who cares?
It annoys me. Surely the White House has more pressing problems than Bush's political standing.
We appeal to the United States not to put Afghanistan into more misery because our people have suffered so much
...as they pull out their AK-47s. Who are they kidding? Phooey.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 205 of 803: winter (winter) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (13:27) * 4 lines
(Mark) Ben's brother works (I believe) for Morgan Stanley...although it's not their head office in NYC... So his odds are good.
I checked with Ben yesterday. You're right, Mark. His brother was midtown, and not in the WTC at the time, thank god.
I tuned into a segement of the "Howard Stern" show yesterday morning... for some unknown reason. It's really very frightening at how "trigger happy" many people are after all this. It's understandable to want to express anger, but there were people calling in ready to invade the Arab/Muslim/South Asian neighborhoods, ready to take revenge. There have alrady been reports of violence. It's complete, total ignorance on their parts, and those callers represent a demographic of this country I'm very ashamed of.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 206 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (13:43) * 6 lines
(Mari) Agree that it's spin, but who cares?
(Eileen) It annoys me.
Me too, but not because of the political standing concern. Rather than make up lies, just tell the American public the truth of what they were doing and why and that is is SOP in such situations. Surely people would understand that.
(Winter) those callers represent a demographic of this country I'm very ashamed of.
Until/unless they violate someone's civil liberties or commit criminal acts, we have to tolerate such things as that is what our country's democracy is all about, i.e., standing up for people's rights to say the most vile things.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 207 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (14:55) * 21 lines
More from stratfor:
U.S. Must Identify State Sponsors
0120 GMT, 010912
Summary
The attacks on the World Trade Center in New York and the Pentagon in Washington, D.C., have sent shockwaves across the nation. While international Islamic terrorists organizations linked to Osama bin Laden's Al-Qa'ida group remain the top suspects, some have suggested nations opposed to U.S. global hegemony may also have been involved. Historically, international terrorism has needed state sponsorship in order to be successful. But such involvement would be tantamount to declaring war on the United States, and although the suspect list is long, there is little evidence at the moment that singles any one country out.
Analysis
The attacks on New York and Washington achieve a number of objectives for the perpetrators. On a strategic level, they demonstrate the vulnerability of the United States. In one fell swoop, the sophisticated and well-coordinated operation paralyzed New York City and the U.S. financial sector, sent the nation's government spiraling into chaos and struck terror in the hearts of the American public. Such a feat, accomplished with only four airline hijackings, is almost impossible to comprehend and will impact U.S. defense and foreign policy for decades to come.
By immobilizing the U.S. financial sector, the strike threatens to push a nation, already suffering from a downturn, into recession. This will have ramifications for U.S. influence throughout the globe. It could also damage U.S. markets abroad as well as numerous other nations with economic ties to the United States.
Understanding the impact of the attack is important for identifying likely suspects. There is good reason to suspect international terrorist organizations linked to Osama bin Laden's umbrella group, Al-Qa'ida. More important, however, is the question of which, if any, states might also have been involved.
The article goes on in much more depth and there are several other articles worth reading at http://www.stratfor.com
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 208 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (15:59) * 42 lines
From my son - his intraoffice email:
The official word from the FAA about the new airport security procedures is
as follows:
Increased passenger and baggage security screenings at all airports.
Passengers should plan to arrive at the
airport a MINIMUM OF TWO HOURS prior to departure.
Passengers must check their luggage at the ticket counter, no curbside
check-in allowed.
Only passengers holding an electronic ticket receipt, travel agency
itinerary, airline ticket card, boarding document, internet printout or
paper ticket will be allowed past the security check point. Passengers
without
receipts of any sort will need to stand in line at the airport
ticket counters to obtain a receipt. (You may also
contact TI and they will mail, fax or email a receipt to you prior
to departing to the airport)
Aircraft and airport security sweeps similar to those conducted during
the Persian Gulf war. Vehicles will be inspected at terminal parking
entrances.
Unattended vehicles are banned near the terminals and will be towed.
No knives of any size, or made from any material, are permitted on
flights. The sale of knifelike items has
been banned at all airports.
Heightened vigilance for unattended bags.
Searches of aircraft cargo and passenger compartments.
An increase in number of uniformed law enforcement and military
personnel.
Random searches of service personal, flight crews and equipment.
Reduces access points to secure areas at airports.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 209 of 803: winter (winter) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (16:26) * 2 lines
Thanks for the info. MArcia. I'm curious to know what the procedures are for our friends in other countries. How do these security measures compare to Europe/Australia/Asia/etc.?
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 210 of 803: Moon Dreams (Moon) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (16:28) * 1 lines
Is this the end of Duty-Free shopping? I must say I am very happy about about the carry-on luggage ban. The size of those things were getting too large.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 211 of 803: Toyce Southern (toyce) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (16:37) * 1 lines
I think you will still be allowed carry on items, but just the curb side check service is gone.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 212 of 803: Moon Dreams (Moon) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (16:53) * 1 lines
I thought they said wallets and purses only.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 213 of 803: Toyce (toyce) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (16:59) * 1 lines
O.k. I just didn't see that in the above post. It's quite possible that they will limit it to that.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 214 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (17:10) * 3 lines
Where does it say anything about limiting carry-ons to wallets or purses? Just no curbside check-in per above.
Can you imagine turning over your camera to the airlines to check in cargo? I don't think so.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 215 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (17:13) * 3 lines
Wonder about laptops carry-ons. I suspect that they will be banned, as well. I guess we carry a well examined purse and a book to read. Who about nail files? knitting needles? Dental floss? The list is endless if one gets tryly inventive. Even a leather belt!
El Al, The Israeli airlines makes inspections like you would not believe. They have the tightest security in the world and NO ONE complains.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 216 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (17:15) * 10 lines
This also from my son about colleagues travelling and caught in this mess: froma memo:
We have heard from the rest of our traveling staff.
DK is making his way to Chicago from Midland, Michigan via
automobile. He is with SS and R. They hope to get on a
morning flight to San Francisco out of Chicago.
DM, who was on personal travel, is also in Chicago trying to
get on a flight or take a Greyhound bus.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 217 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (17:20) * 272 lines
At Last the Aggressors Themselves Are Able to Wedge
In a Word Or Two *8-/
Subject: Islamic Jihad, what is next ?
Date: Thursday, September 13, 2001 1:53 AM
From: felipe rodriquez
Reply-To: "felipe rodriquez"
To:
ISLAMIC JIHAD, what is next ?
(c) Felipe Rodriquez
INTRODUCTION
The attack on the World Trade Center in New York is a new phase in an
ongoing global religious and ideological conflict. This conflict started in
1990, with the gulf war. The mother of all wars, as Saddam Hussein called
it, and is unlikely to end for some time. To understand this conflict, we
must look at the Western world's exploitation and colonization of Saudi
Arabia and other Muslim nations . Economic and geopolitical moves that
benefit only the western democratic capitalist structures are the primary
cause of this terrible conflict.
USAMA BIN MUHAMMAD BIN IN LADEN
The Taliban consider Osama Bin Ladin to be a holy man, because of his
incredible service in the Afghani war against the Russians, and the
reconstruction of Afghanistan. Osama Bin Ladin has fought hundreds of
battles in Afghanistan, and has been wounded numerous times. He went to
Afghanistan around 1982, and took with him a large amount of construction
equipment, and a team of engineers, to rebuild the war torn country.
Consequently he became involved in many battles, and was wounded many times.
He is a devout Muslim, and answers to Allah and certain important Islamic
teachers, such as Sheik Safar Ibn `Abd Al-Rahman Al-Hawali.
He founded the "Al Qaeda" movement, with Muhammad Atef. The movement was
initially setup to record the movements of Mujahedin in Afghanistan. Later
the goal changed to driving the United States forces out of Saudi Arabia,
where the US setup a military base since the beginning of the Gulf War. Many
devout Muslims see this as a hostile invasion of the Islamic holy land,
comparable to the invasions of the crusaders in the past. Some years later
the goal changed once again, into what it is now; to attack Israel, the US
and its allies wherever it can. The justification of these acts, in the mind
of the Muslim activist, comes from the foreign occupation of the holy
cities; Mecca, Medina and Jerusalem.
It is simplistic and short sighted to assume that Osama Bin Laden is the
great leader behind the attacks on the WTC, the Nairobi and Dar Es Salaam US
embassies, the hit on USS Cole in Yemen and various other terrorist attacks.
Islamic religious activism is the glue that binds this global terror
movement together. Removing Osama Bin Ladin from the scene will not remove
this global movement, and will not end terror. Killing him will only
motivate thousands of Muslims to volunteer for the ultimate sacrifice.
The Islamic radical movement resembles a hydra, A serpent represented as
having many heads, one of which, when cut off, is immediately succeeded by
two others. The movement cannot be eradicated by violence and retaliation,
such deeds will only make it stronger and increase popular support in the
Islamic world.
To understand how this works, lets look at Hizbollah and Hamas. These
Islamic organizations have been setup in such a way that they are almost
impossible to eradicate. There is always double redundancy in the
leadership, because any leader can expect to be assassinated by their
enemies at any time. The effectiveness of this redundancy is demonstrated by
the fact that Hizbollah and Hamas still exist today, despite the fact that
many of its leaders have been assassinated by Israel and others.
We must assume that the leadership of the organization that hit the WTC, and
other targets in the past, is organized in a similar way, building on the
experience of Islamic organizations in Lebanon, Palestine and elsewhere.
Hamas and Hizbollah have integrated Islamic thought in their society by
providing numerous services to their communities. Schools and hospitals are
provided for free or at cost. And they materially support families, widows
and orphans that have been victims of aggression by their enemies. Hizbollah
operates numerous businesses, that together with donations fund the
activities of the organization. These social activities provide the
organizations with enormous popular support, it is an effective way of
disseminating the virtues of Islam, and strengthening its base. It has also
created a strong platform to recruit martyrs for the violent Jihad (Holy
War) against Israel and its allies.
>From documentation that was seized in Africa, after the Nairobi bombing,
there is a strong indication that a cell structure was used to limit the
risks to the terrorist organization that hit the African embassies,
allegedly the same organization that hit the WTC in 2001. A cell structure
is often used by violent groups. It is implemented in such a way that cell
members only know a limited amount of members of the organization, and only
have limited access to information about the planned activities of the
group. Typically cell members only know the coordinator of the cell, and the
coordinator only knows one higher placed member of the organization. The aim
of the cell structure is to protect the organization, in case of arrests and
torturous interrogations.
The violent faction of the Islamic activist movement, such as the Islamic
front for Jihad, is mostly invisible. It has been hardened through years of
struggle in Lebanon, Palestine, Iraq and Afghanistan. It is acutely aware of
its security requirements, because numerous Islamic activists have been
assassinated in the past.
The WTC attack, and the other attacks in the past demonstrate that they have
relatively good communication security; they most likely assume that all
electronic communication is monitored by the US and its allies through their
global Echelon surveillance system and the FBI's Carnivore software. Human
infiltration of these groups is not likely either, most of these Islamic
activists have been working together for many years. An infiltrator would
have to speak fluent Arabic, would have to have intimate knowledge of the
Quran and Islamic religious rituals, and would have to be willing to make
the ultimate sacrifice, Martyrdom, to earn the trust of the organization. In
1853 adventurer Richard Burton managed to disguise himselfe as a Muslim
Derwish, participate in the Pilgrimage to Mecca and Al- Madinah, and came
back alive. But he was the exception to the rule, and he did not try to
infiltrate a terrorist organization that expects infiltration attempts.
INTENTIONS AND MOTIVATIONS
"The people of Islam awakened and realized that they are the main
target for the aggression of the Zionist-Crusaders alliance. All false
claims and propaganda about "Human Rights" were hammered down and exposed
by the massacres that took place against the Muslims in every part of the
world. The latest and the greatest of these aggressions, incurred by the
Muslims since the death of the Prophet (ALLAH'S BLESSING AND SALUTATIONS
ON HIM) is the occupation of the land of the two Holy Places"
(Source: A DECLARATION OF WAR, by Osama Bin Laden.
http://msanews.mynet.net//MSANEWS/199610/19961012.3.html)
A growing group of Islamic scholars and activists feel that the military
installations of the United States in Saudi Arabia represent a hostile
foreign invasion into their holy land. They believe that the three most holy
places in the Islamic world, Mecca, Medina and Jerusalem, are occupied by
Zionists and Christian crusaders. They also believe that most Muslim
nations are victims of neo-colonialist exploitation by the capitalist
western world. A holy war, Jihad, was declared in 1996 to struggle against
exploitation and occupation.
In 1998 a Fatwah was declared by Sheikh Usamah Bin-Muhammad Bin-Ladin, Ayman
al-Zawahiri, amir of the Jihad Group in Egypt, Abu-Yasir Rifa'i Ahmad Taha,
Egyptian Islamic Group, Sheikh Mir Hamzah, secretary of the
Jamiat-ul-Ulema-e-Pakistan and Fazlul Rahman, amir of the Jihad Movement in
Bangladesh. This Fatwah reconfirms the holy war against Israel, the US and
its allies. A quote from this Fatwah:
"The ruling to kill the Americans and their allies -- civilians and
military -- is an individual duty for every Muslim who can do it in any
country in which it is possible to do it, in order to liberate the al-Aqsa
Mosque and the holy mosque [Mecca] from their grip, and in order for their
armies to move out of all the lands of Islam, defeated and unable to
threaten any Muslim. This is in accordance with the words of Almighty God,
"and fight the pagans all together as they fight you all together," and
"fight them until there is no more tumult or oppression, and there prevail
justice and faith in God." (Source: World Islamic Front Statement 23
February 1998, http://www.fas.org/irp/world/para/docs/980223-fatwa.htm)
Safar Ibn `Abd Al-Rahman Al-Hawali, an important Islamic scholar and
ideologue and highly regarded by Osama Bin Ladin, recently wrote a book, The
Day of Wrath, describing various biblical prophecies.
He describes, among other things: "The attributes of the victorious army,
the collapse of the Zionist forces and the fate of the strategic ally of the
Zionist state (United States)." He states that the beginning of the new era
will be with the announcement of Jihad. And goes on to say that: "It is
futile for the enemies of Allah to compete with Him in weapons!" and "On the
other hand, as if at the signal of a trumpet, the Palestinian refugees
return to their homes, and after the great battle is over the Muslims,
especially those from Egypt and Iraq, are called to the Holy Land to visit
its sanctuary and spend time in worship within its environs." He goes on to
speculate that the reconquest of Jerusalem will take place in 2012.
True or not, we cannot deny the fact that the organizers of this Jihad
believe they are part of this prophecy, and believe that their struggle will
ultimately be successful. This has given them great moral strength,
perseverance, and willingness to sacrifice.
NEXT TARGETS
We should be prepared for the possibility that the WTC bombing is only the
beginning of a new era of warfare. This group has shown repeatedly what
their capabilities are. They have been given no reasons to stop their Jihad;
the US still has military bases in Saudi Arabia, Jerusalem is still occupied
by the Israeli's, and the western world is still perceived to be
implementing its systems of neo-colonialist exploitation on most, if not
all, Muslim nations.
Much will depend on the actions of the US and NATO. Pinpoint retaliation by
them is not possible, because they are fighting an invisible enemy.
President Bush has already stated that no difference will be made between
those countries that harbor terrorists, and the terrorists themselves.
Therefore it is likely that the US and NATO will shed the blood of innocent
Muslims, causing increasing popular support for the Jihad. Retaliation by
the US and NATO would be a precedent for the organisers of the Jihad to
engage in further attacks and further retaliation.
Any future targets of violence by this group are likely to be of greater
symbolic and material value than the WTC tragedy. Destruction of the Vatican
in Rome comes to mind immediately. The radical Islamists consider the
Catholic church to be corrupt, and its destruction would cause a complete
loss of morale for many people in the Western world. The White House is an
obvious target, as is Tel Aviv, the European Parliament in Brussels and
other centres of power. Additionally they may target military targets, such
as NATO headquarters, the Menwith Hill spy base in the UK, and similar sites
around the world.
In an interview Osama Bin Ladin expressed that it is his religious duty to
obtain weapons of mass destruction. We cannot discard the possibility of a
terrorist attack on a city with biological or even nuclear weapons.
THE SOLUTION ?
A solution is unlikely to come up anytime soon. The allies of the US and
Israel will most likely respond with violence, instead of analyzing the
causes of this movement. The Western focus seems to be to eradicate these
terrorist movements through violence and prosecution, by implementing
stronger intelligence systems and implementing additional internal security
systems. President Bush has already stated that he will attack any nation
that harbors and protects terrorists. Thereby laying the groundwork for acts
of war that are likely to be highly inaccurate, causing many civilian
casualties. If the history of the Middle East gives any indication, we can
speculate that violence will be answered by more violence and aggression.
Retaliation is at best the wrong answer, at worst it could be a catastrophic
mistake.
The start of a solution would be to look at the causes that have created
this violent movement. Why are so many Muslims upset with the Western world
and Israel ? Why have they been driven into a position where the only answer
they perceive possible in their struggle is unprecedented violence and
aggression ? Why do they feel cheated, raped and abused by the western
worlds military and capitalist system ? Why do they not trust the US and
Europe at the negotiating table, and instead see them as targets for
terrorist strikes ? We must go back into history, and realize which mistakes
have been made by our nations. We must recognize our total lack of respect
and appreciation for anything different than the modern western system of
democracy and capitalism. Only then will we arrive at some answers that
could lead us to an end of this Jihad.
This is highly unlikely to happen though and therefore the situation will
likely get worse before it gets better.
(c) Felipe Rodriquez
Sources:
Frontline - http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/binladen/
A declaration of war from Usama Bin Laden -
http://msanews.mynet.net//MSANEWS/199610/19961012.3.html
World Islamic Front Statement -
http://www.library.cornell.edu/colldev/mideast/wif.htm
The DAY of WRATH - http://home.swbell.net/jhaidar/0_preface.htm
Foreign Terrorist Organizations -
http://www.state.gov/www/global/terrorism/fto_1999.html
The next presidents terrorism policy -
http://www.terrorism.com/analysis/TerrorismPolicy.pdf
The Use of Force in Response to Terrorism -
http://www.terrorism.com/terrorism/Force.shtml
WMD TERRORISM AND USAMA BIN LADEN -
http://cns.miis.edu/pubs/reports/binladen.htm
Suitcase Nuclear Devices - http://www.prop1.org/2000/suitcase.htm
CNN - http://www.cnn.com
Hezbollah by Hala Jaber - Columbia Univ Pr; ISBN: 0231108346
A pilgrimage to Al-Madinah and Meccah by R. Burton - AES; ISBN 81-206-0903-4
Gideons Spies by Gordon Thomas - Pan Books; ISBN: 033037537
The Fateful Triangle by Noam Chomski - Pluto press; ISBN: 0745315305
Pity the Nation by Robert Fisk - Oxford University Press; ISBN: 019285284-1
The terrorism reader by David J. Whittaker - Routledge; ISBN: 0-415-22134-X
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 218 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (17:21) * 5 lines
http://interactive.wsj.com/public/resources/documents/Tenant-List.htm
is a list of building tenants with status reports on tenants and business.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 219 of 803: Beth (Bethanne) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (17:25) * 5 lines
I really hope these security precaustions are permanant. I hope to God, they aren't eased up on when people start complaining about the inconvenience.
According to the FAA, they claim they have been calling for all airport security personel to become federal employees and trained and paid accordingly, for quite some time. Thet were trying to enforce this, but backed off when all the airlines began protesting.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 220 of 803: rachael (rachael) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (17:35) * 8 lines
(Marcia) Only passengers holding an electronic ticket receipt, travel agency itinerary, airline ticket card, boarding document, internet printout or
paper ticket will be allowed past the security check point
winter, you asked about procedures in Europe - the above has always been the case in the UK to my knowledge - certainly any time I've flown, whether within the UK, within Europe, or to North America (USA and Canada) you cannot get into the departure lounge without a boarding pass which is issued at check-in (and passport for international flights); non-passengers are not allowed past that point. Then at the boarding gate you must show your pass again. If a checked-in passenger does not board, but has put luggage on the plane, the plane will not fly until the luggage has come off.
Check in times for USA/Canada have been two hours minimum every time I've done the trip; within Europe its usually an hour; I know someone who checked in 30 minutes before a flight to Dublin (thus was technically late) and was not allowed to board because she'd breeched security regulations.
what is curb side check in?
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 221 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (18:07) * 1 lines
There are skycaps at the entrances (curb) who will take your bags and they are put on the plane. You have to produce a valid ticket and photo identification. This is only for domestic flights. Plus you have to tip these guys per bag.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 222 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (19:42) * 162 lines
Science@NASA is based in the United States, but among our many subscribers
are a substantial number of readers from other countries. In recent days
many of them have written to us expressing their sympathies and horror at
the events of Sept. 11th. Their messages, attached below, reveal how the
heart-breaking loss of life in New York, Washington, D.C., and
Pennsylvania touches everyone. The staff of Science@NASA extend our
heartfelt condolences to the many victims of Tuesday's tragedy, and we
thank our friends overseas for their kind messages of support as we
resume, later today, our regular schedule of scientific story-telling.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
TO: Ron.koczor@msfc.nasa.gov
FROM: inna_mar@XXXXXXXX.ru
Dear Mr. Koczor,
All of us are shocked by the awful events that have occurred yesterday in
New York and in Washington and we wish to extend our sympathy to you and
your colleagues.
If there is any way that we can help, please let us know.
Sincerely,
Inna Mardanyan
Moscow, Russia
****************************
TO: Ron.koczor@msfc.nasa.gov
FROM: gushat@XXXXXXX.ru
Dear friends,
Your colleagues from Paleontological Institute of Moscow are with you.
Our sympathy, thoughts and support are yours. And will always be.
Best regards,
Alexei Rzanov, Galina Ushatinskaya, and all colleagues from Moscow
****************************
TO: Ron.koczor@msfc.nasa.gov
FROM: snassopoulou@XXXXXXX.gr
Dear Ron,
We are very sorry and really left astonished and speechless with terrorism
struck US yesterday. We sincerely wish and hope that everything is OK for
you and all the American colleagues and families.
Yours,
Sophia
Athens, Greece
****************************
TO: phillips@spacescience.com
FROM: tony.taggett@XXXXXXX.uk
Dear Dr Phillips
As my only point of contact with the United States is through your
science@NASA website, I would like to express my heartfelt condolences to
the American people, our thoughts and prayers especially go out to the
relatives and friends of those who perished in the awful events that
occurred yesterday
Yours Sincerely
Tony Aggett
United Kingdom
*****************************
TO: ron.koczor@msfc.nasa.gov
FROM: mmazzolini@XXXXXX.au
We would like to offer our deepfelt sympathy, concern and prayers to our
friends and colleagues in the US at this dreadful time,
Margaret and Alex Mazzolini
Melbourne, Australia
*****************************
TO: ron.koczor@msfc.nasa.gov
FROM: omaro@XXXXXX.kz
We are absolutely shocked by horrible events in the U.S. It is
unbelievable...Accept my condolences...Today our world has changed. What
will happen to our world?
Take care,
Prof Omarov
Alma Aty, Khazakstan
*****************************
TO: ron.koczor@msfc.nasa.gov
FROM: cofXXXXX@home.com
As the President of CANADIAN Environmental Science and Research Group and
on behalf of the Team of CESAR Group I would like to send our heart felt
sorrow to those family members who lost relatives in these vicious and
despicable attacks on democracy. God Bless America!
Jack Pender
Canada
*****************************
From: Rafael Cárdenas Santacruz
To: Ronald.J.Koczor@msfc.nasa.gov
Sincere greetings Dr. Koczor, Ron
Together with my family, we feel very sorry for the regrettable incidents
in New York. We are with you with all our hearts.
Rafael Cardenas Santacruz
Scientific Technician
Bogota, Columbia
*****************************
TO: Ron.koczor@msfc.nasa.gov
FROM: jarl.ahlbeck@XXXXX.fi
In the 1930's Stalin deported and murdered 25,000 Finns that were
peacefully living on the Soviet side of the border. It was a blind terror
action against civilians, a complete ethnical cleaning of the Karelia
county. Without successful defensive fight in the following winter war
1939 when Stalin tried to invade Finland (5 of my uncles were killed, my
father injured), we would, according to recently discovered documents from
Moscow, all have been deported to Siberia, and I would not sit here and
study your website.
These terrorists try to create a world of that kind. We do not want this
world anymore!
All the best for you in the USA
Jarl
Helsinki, Finland
****************************
Necochea, 11/9/01
TO: ron.koczor@msfc.nasa.gov
NASA:
Hi¡, My name is Maria. I am aware of the attack that has been perpetrated
against your country, and I am very sad. I live in Buenos Aires,
Argentina. I am 14 years old and there is not much that I can do to help,
but I profoundly admire you and you have my moral support. I would like to
ask you a favor. Please reach an agreement without wars, but I hope those
responsible are found, so that peace will be extended throughout the
world.
Sincerely,
Maguie.
*****************************
From: Jonathon Dugdale
To: patrick.meyer@msfc.nasa.gov
Sent: 9/11/01 12:37 PM
Subject: Condolences
On behalf of all the employees and stakeholders of ApexMail I would like
to say that we share in your shock, grief and pain resulting from today's
unspeakable and cowardly assault. Our thoughts and prayers are with you
and the people of America.
Jonathon Dugdale
Apexmail, Inc
Canada
*****************************
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Response 223 of 803: Mari Fulginiti (mari) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (20:06) * 47 lines
(Marcia) El Al, The Israeli airlines makes inspections like you would not believe. They have the tightest security in the world and NO ONE complains.
Right on, Marcia. Below is a fascinating article from today's Philly Inquirer on airport security in Israel. Take a moment to read this, everyone. IMO, *this* is the type of dialogue we should be having, and people need to think now about the balance of personal freedoms and civil liberties vs. much more aggressive security measures. How much of the former are you willing to give up in order to achieve the latter? A little? A lot? I don't have the answers but this is the type of thing I meant before when I wrote that I wondered if people would have the stomach for doing what may be required in the new world order. Military retaliation is only part of it.
How Israel remains a model of airport security
By Michael Matza
INQUIRER STAFF WRITER
JERUSALEM - As the United States moves to tighten security at its airports, it may look to the world's model of truly tough airport defense: Israel.
Here, any trip on Israel's national airline, El Al, involves not only metal detectors but luggage searches, armed in-flight guards, and a personal grilling by a specially trained antiterrorism officer.
Security agents routinely "profile" passengers to single out for extra attention Arabs or foreigners who fit ethnic or other parameters.
Any foreign visitor who has taken off from Ben Gurion Airport near Tel Aviv knows the drill: arrive two hours before departure, pass all luggage through a monster of a metal detector; open carry-on bags, which sometimes have to be unpacked on a stainless-steel table; and submit to interrogation by a no-nonsense screener.
Where have you been in Israel? Whom did you meet? Did you go to the occupied territories of the West Bank and Gaza? Whom did you talk to there?
Did you pack your own bags? Are you carrying any gifts? Did anyone give you anything to carry? Do you speak Hebrew? Can you read Hebrew? Have you ever studied Hebrew? Do you understand that I am asking these questions because what may seem like a gift to you may actually be an explosive device?
Passengers of Arabic extraction say the questioning can last a very long time and often feels like harassment. Israelis tend to think of it as a necessary evil. In the United States, "profiling" would not pass constitutional muster.
"I think that 99 percent of the passengers understand very well the need for security arrangements, and there are not many complaints," said Pini Schiff, spokesman for the Israeli Airport Authority and former head of airport security.
"I can tell you, in general terms, that in two or three minutes of questioning, the screeners are doing their best to learn the passenger's aim for coming to Israel," Schiff said. "All the flight checkers are hired by us and trained by us. They go through extensive background checks. All of them have served in the Israeli army and have to pass several tests to make sure that they have the capabilities to do the job."
When a passenger's answers don't add up, he is denied a boarding pass. Schiff declined to say how often that happens.
By questioning passengers, guards quickly can spot those who appear nervous, said Leo Gleser, a former El Al security officer and head of ISDS, a security-consulting firm.
In the case of Tuesday's hijackers in the United States, "not all of them would have made it onto the plane" if the Israeli approach to security had been used, Gleser told the Associated Press. "If you detect one, you can start to ask questions" that might lead to the other members of the group.
As another security measure, Ben Gurion passengers are taken by waiting buses to the planes, which are parked far from the terminal on guarded runways.
And, although official sources in Israel would not confirm it, it is widely believed that armed, undercover security guards ride aboard every El Al flight.
"We've provided information in the past to other airlines and other airport authorities, and we will continue to share our expertise," said Nachman Kleiman, spokesman for El Al. Kleiman declined yesterday to say whether El Al had consulted with the Federal Aviation Administration on the new U.S. measures.
"I can tell you that El Al maintains a high level of security for its passengers by not discussing its procedures in the media," he said.
Israeli Transportation Minister Efraim Sneh predicted that Tuesday's attacks would lead to security changes. But instead of bringing more high-tech responses, he said, they likely would reinforce the low-tech methods.
"Our screening method is based on identifying the suspect traveler and concentrating on the characteristics of the person," Sneh said. "Screening for explosives only works when the terrorists are using explosives."
As the world now knows, for Tuesday's terrorists, the plane was the bomb.
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Response 224 of 803: nancy (nky) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (20:21) * 7 lines
Hi everyone!
I just like to say that I used work on Wall Street and now am working in midtown. Unfortunately I still have many clients from the downtown location especially in the twin towers. The downtown area is my playground. I know every building and every street. I can name most of the businesses with their building address. I've been watching the news and they're flashing the names of all the businesses in the twin towers and it is devastating to see all the names that I know and was conducting business with. I'm in the buildings couple of times a week for meetings and I was very lucky for not being in the area the day it all happened.
My heart and sympathy goes out to all my clients and their families. I can't even begin to say how I feel and have been feeling the past couple of days.
I like to also thank all of you for all your wonderful support.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 225 of 803: winter (winter) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (20:23) * 4 lines
Sorry to spend so much time on the airport security issue... I've heard conflicting reports about what can now be accepted as "carry on" baggage. Some have said that purses and wallets only (what to do with backpacks?), others have said that there are no changes except that curbside check in is now banned.
Am leaving for Indonesia next month (will live there for a year), packing a laptop, videocam and 35mm camera, books, files, clothes, etc.. Oh dear.
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Response 226 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (20:25) * 1 lines
Thanks for that, Mari! When I board a plane I want to get to my destination in one piece with my nervous system intact. I have nothing to hide. Search us all and put the fear of a real God in them!
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 227 of 803: Lucille Oftedahl (alyeska) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (20:29) * 1 lines
The web grows larger and larger. Germany and Italy to name two.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 228 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (20:45) * 1 lines
re: Carry-ons, they suggest we had better be prepared to turn on our laptops if we carry them on. Take photos with our digitals and so on. If you are using a standard camera, I'd suggest an empty one so they can open it and see it is just a camera. I am flying to my son's wedding next month. I am just as concerned as you are. I am heading over a very deep ocean and heading for San Francisco. I want to get there intact. I only have one child! I want to attend his wedding!
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 229 of 803: Wolf (wolf) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (20:57) * 4 lines
G O D
B L E S S
A M E R I C A ! ! !
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 230 of 803: Wolf (wolf) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (20:57) * 1 lines
(of course the flag didn't show up--hang on)
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 231 of 803: Wolf (wolf) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (20:58) * 1 lines
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 232 of 803: Wolf (wolf) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (21:02) * 3 lines
let's try again---
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 233 of 803: Wolf (wolf) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (21:08) * 5 lines
as an american, it is heart-warming and pride-inducing to hear and feel the goodwill coming across this computer, the tv, and looking out the window. please keep it up. we have friends in the pentagon and know how close to home this has come for us. GOD BLESS YOU ALL!
and please, please remember, that anger will not fix this tragedy, will not bring anyone back. feel it but don't act on it. the majority of foreigners who have come here have come for the same reason our pilgrims did so long ago. i am angry, appalled, and very saddened by these events. pray for the leaders of all the countries of the world.
please display your flag, put your lights on when you're driving around running errands and take the time to thank your servicemen and women of all walks...this is what they train for.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 234 of 803: Wolf (wolf) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (21:15) * 1 lines
did you see London playing our National Anthem? i had goosebumps! thank you, that was very moving!! ABC needs to play it again!!
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Response 235 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (21:18) * 5 lines
Re: Israeli airline security
I know many people who have gone through it for years. You live with it.
In the United States, "profiling" would not pass constitutional muster.
It's done right now at the airports at customs on your return.... Has a smuggler sued on that basis???
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 236 of 803: Wolf (wolf) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (21:29) * 3 lines
i think that security at airports will make honest people feel safe but bad guys do think, how would airports prevent the bad guys from hiring in? and who's to say that that hasn't happened already.
after all this destruction, the news just reported that several people are in custody from JFK and the G airport (i can't spell it at all). i don't know. we all know how bits of info turn into other things and then we have to go back and amend what was reported.
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Response 237 of 803: Liz K (ekelley) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (22:19) * 1 lines
its LaGuardia. They arrested 5 people at JFK and 4 at LGA. all were of middle east extraction, sporting phony pilots licenses, demanding to get on those flights. They were arrested. Apparently, a group of 3 men tried to get on a flight on Tuesday at JFK, the pilot was suspicious, called port authority police and then the 3 men vanished...
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 238 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (22:24) * 3 lines
Suspicious stuff was detected at check-in and the guys vanished. No pilots were involved.
However, I just heard that a pilot and some flight attendants just tested our new airport security with a pocket knife, a corkscrew and false identification and walked right through and then turned around and told the security personnel. :-(
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 239 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (22:27) * 1 lines
Oh Karen!!! I am happy I have a month before my flight.
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Response 240 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (22:38) * 3 lines
Two groups got arrested/detained today trying to board airplanes with fake id's and knives. Peter Jennings was just talking to Senator Joseph Biden, pressing hard to get him to comment on whether or not we're still under attack. He said these guys were the second string and the crisis was over, but he looked visiably shaken and wasn't very convincing. An astrounding comment he made was that he was afraid where Jennings was going to go next and both of them looked shaken. Cheney was moved to Camp David today. Washington was evacuated.
>
>Whoever's running around with the suitcase nuke or the biological weapon has to be found and stopped before a far worse scenario unfolds.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 241 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (23:23) * 2 lines
The collapse of the WTC towers was detected as a M2.5 on the Richter.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 242 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (23:28) * 1 lines
Not a surprise since each of those floor slabs weighed 300 tons.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 243 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (23:37) * 12 lines
Perhaps it is time to relearn the 4th verse of the National Anthem of the United States. I much prefer it to what we sing now!
Oh! thus be it ever, when freemen shall stand
Between their loved homes and the war's desolation!
Blest with victory and peace, may the heaven-rescued land
Praise the Power that hath made and preserved us a nation.
Then conquer we must, for our cause it is just,
And this be our motto: "In God is our trust."
And the star-spangled banner forever shall wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave!
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 244 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (23:48) * 3 lines
http://www.cnn.com/2001/US/09/13/jfk.airport.detained/index.html
about today's two hijack attempts.
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Response 245 of 803: Mari Fulginiti (mari) * Thu, Sep 13, 2001 (23:53) * 18 lines
I know many people who have gone through it for years. You live with it.
My point exactly.
It's done right now at the airports at customs on your return.... Has a smuggler sued on that basis???
Karen, you know they're talking about profiling on the basis of ethnicity--not picking on middle-class ladies who come off the flight from Milan carrying too many Ferragamo bags.;-).
Re: the Jennings/Biden interview. I saw that too, Terry. Was that the most bizarre interview you've ever seen, or what? Now, it's emerging that these guys were all trying to board flights to the west coast (i.e., planes loaded with fuel); armed with knives; and carrying pilot training certs from the same school in Fla. that the Tuesday bombers had attended. Same M-0! Yet, earlier today, the FAA says it's safe to fly and opens the airports. Now, oops--not NY! The FAA is totally incompetent, IMO, and should be removed immediately from having jurisdiction over whether the planes can be permitted to fly.
However, I just heard that a pilot and some flight attendants just tested our new airport security with a pocket knife, a corkscrew and false identification and walked right through and then turned around and told the security personnel. :-(
See my FAA comment above. It's like Groundhog Day. We keep doing the same thing over and over again, sending out the same poorly-trained minimum wage personnel to do a job that other countries employ highly trained people to do. When I saw the new FAA "security procedures," I'd have laughed if it weren't so pathetic. No plastic knives, huh? Well, that's ok, since they never cut through the crummy food they give you anyway.;-) Seriously, this is *so* primitive!
Unbelievable--as I'm typing this, Ted Koppel is interviewing a passenger from the JFK flight. He said they were ready to take off, then about 20 SWAT team members rushed aboard shouting at everyone to hit the floor, and they pulled 3 people off the flight, one of whom was violently resisting arrest. But hey, let's open those airports. :-( I'm at a loss.
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Response 246 of 803: Beth (Bethanne) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (00:20) * 1 lines
NASA released aerial shots today, of lower Manhatttan taken from outer space. The pre-collapse smoke eminating from the twin towers, is clearly visible. So is the big gaping gap where the twin towers used to be, once they collpased. It was surreal seeing the pictures.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 247 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (00:22) * 6 lines
you know they're talking about profiling on the basis of ethnicity--not picking on middle-class ladies who come off the flight from Milan carrying too many Ferragamo bags.;-).
LOL! Am reminded of my astonishment that my own parents were not strip-searched many many years ago on their return from Hong Kong. They must be the only people on the face of the earth who bought nothing. Who would've believed that? ;-)
But seriously, ethnic and other profiling is routine at security/customs checkpoints now. Take drugs for example...or the chubby white guy with Rolexes up and down his arm.
Have just heard back from my cousin, an air traffic controller in Miami. He too says there's no likelihood that any plane would've been a threat to Air Force One. What shocked him is the return to DC. Even after the 4th plane crashed in PA, there were still thousands of planes still in the air. That's why he couldn't go back to DC.
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Response 248 of 803: Rob Glennie (AotearoaKiwi) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (05:28) * 6 lines
Hi all
I may have upset one or two people when I said "Why do many Americans want war?"
for which I apologise but these people did not care who got hit and some people thought the Libyans should be bombed even though Muhammad Gadaffi (right person??)condemned the attacks. If Libya did have a role then they deserve to get hit but I am only seeing stuff about the Osama bin Laden monster who resides in Afghanistan and whom should be extradited and tried anyway, OR if he is the mastermind, bombed into the ground. Bombs away if they are implicated, and GOD BLESS THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! GOD BLESS FREEDOM AND GOD BLESS HUMANITY!!!!!!!!!
Rob
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Response 249 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (09:29) * 1 lines
Could you unlock your Cap Lock key? Thanks.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 250 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (09:49) * 85 lines
My sister sent this to me, I think it's in wide circulation on the net.
Subject: From: "Nadia Zierke"
TRIBUTE TO THE UNITED STATES
This, from a Canadian newspaper, is worth sharing.
America: The Good Neighbor.
Widespread but only partial news coverage was given recently to a
remarkable editorial broadcast from Toronto by Gordon Sinclair, a
Canadian television commentator. What follows is the full text of his
Trenchant remarks as printed in the Congressional Record:
"This Canadian thinks it is time to speak up for the Americans as the
most generous and possibly the least appreciated people on all the earth.
Germany, Japan and, to a lesser extent, Britain and Italy were lifted out
of the debris of war by the Americans who poured in billions of dollars
and forgave other billions in debts. None of these countries is today
paying even the interest on its remaining debts to the United States.
When France was in danger of collapsing in 1956, it was the Americans who
propped it up, and their reward was to be insulted and swindled on the
streets of Paris. I was there. I saw it.
When earthquakes hit distant cities, it is the United States that hurries
in to help. This spring, 59 American communities were flattened by
tornadoes. Nobody helped.
The Marshall Plan and the Truman Policy pumped billions of dollars into
discouraged countries. Now newspapers in those countries are writing
about the decadent, warmongering Americans.
I'd like to see just one of those countries that is gloating over the
erosion of the United States dollar build its own airplane. Does any
other country in the world have a plane to equal the Boeing Jumbo Jet,
the Lockheed Tri-Star, or the Douglas DC10?
If so, why don't they fly them? Why do all the International lines except
Russia fly American Planes? You talk about Japanese technocracy, and you
get radios. You talk about German technocracy, and you get automobiles.
You talk about American technocracy, and you find men on the moon - not
once, but several times - and safely home again.
You talk about scandals, and the Americans put theirs right in the store
window for everybody to look at. Even their draft-dodgers are not pursued
and hounded. They are here on our streets, and most of them, unless they
are breaking Canadian laws, are getting American dollars from ma and pa
at home to spend here.
When the railways of France, Germany and India were breaking down through
age, it was the Americans who rebuilt them. When the Pennsylvania
Railroad and the New York Central went broke, nobody loaned them an old
caboose. Both are still broke.
I can name you 5000 times when the Americans raced to the help of other
people in trouble. Can you name me even one time when someone else raced
to the Americans in trouble? I don't think there was outside help even
during the San Francisco earthquake.
Our neighbors have faced it alone, and I'm one Canadian who is damned
tired of hearing them get kicked around. They will come out of this thing
with their flag high. And when they do, they are entitled to thumb their
nose at the lands that are gloating over their present troubles. I hope
Canada is not one of those."
Stand proud, America!
Wear it proudly!!
This is one of the best editorials that I have ever read regarding the
United States. It is nice that one man realizes it. I only wish that the
This is one of the best editorials that I have ever read regarding the
United States. It is nice that one man realizes it. I only wish that the
rest of the world would realize it. We are always blamed for everything,
and never even get a thank you for the things we do.
I would hope that each of you would send this to as many people as you
can and emphasize that they should send it to as many of their friends
until this letter is sent to every person on the web. I am just a single
American that has read this, I SURE HOPE THAT A LOT MORE READ IT SOON.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 251 of 803: Vera (kolin) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (09:53) * 13 lines
"Tribute to the United States"
This was written by Gordon Sinclair in 1973 regarding the Vietnam war.
Gordon Sinclair died in 1984, but his sentiments resonate powerfully
today.
Canadians mourn with the Americans and are prepared to help any way
they can.
Anywhere between 50-500 Canadians are expected to be among the
casualties of this horrific act.
We are going to have a nationwide memorial service and moment of
silence today.
This attack was against all of us no matter where we live or come
from.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 252 of 803: Evelyn (lafn) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (10:11) * 3 lines
"you know they're talking about profiling on the basis of ethnicity.."
I can just see the suits now on the basis of racial discrimination . We are a litigious society. This would never be tolerated.
For years I was searched at Heathrow; someone on the Most Wanted List must have looked like me. I never minded. But this would never be done in the US.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 253 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (10:12) * 1 lines
Yes, that email is making its rounds.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 254 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (11:24) * 64 lines
Two of the world's most impressive structures have been taken down and
over 10% of New Yorks office space has been eliminated.
You get a sinking feeling when you read Bin Laden's biography and read
that he has a degree in 1979 from King Abdul Aziz University in ...
Civil Engineering.
He has been running a construction company for over a quarter of a
century.
Meanwhile . . .
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - About 20 police officers, many in SWAT gear,
stormed an American Airlines jetliner at New York's Kennedy Airport on
Thursday, subduing one man and handcuffing two others, possibly
thwarting a hijacking attempt, a passenger aboard the plane told ABC
News.
http://us.news2.yimg.com/f/42/31/7m/dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20010914/ts/attack_tradecenter_report_dc_1.html
More (from CNN):
10 people arrested, getting on two planes -- one in JFK, one in
LaGuardia.
Some were trained in piloting at the same school as the hijackers on
Tuesday.
Some got caught at checkpoints, some made it onto planes.
"WASHINGTON, NEW YORK (Reuters)"
...
"The Defense Department asked Bush to authorize the activation of tens of
thousands of military reserve troops for ''homeland defense'', defense
officials said."
"Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld planned to activate between 30,000 and
50,000 reservists to provide ``strike-alert'' jet fighter protection and
perform other duties at domestic military bases."
...
"Afghanistan's ruling Taliban movement, which shelters bin Laden, warned
of revenge ``by other means' if the United States attacked their country
in retaliation for Tuesday's attacks."
...
"An ABC News/Washington Post poll released on Friday showed that nearly
nine in 10 Americans approved of Bush's job performance -- a huge leap in
the aftermath of Tuesday's terror attacks."
"Nearly seven out of 10 Americans supported military action against the
groups or countries responsible for the attacks, even if that meant a
long
war with heavy U.S. casualties, the poll found."
http://us.news2.yimg.com/f/42/31/7m/dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20010914/ts/attack_dc_40.html
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 255 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (11:27) * 48 lines
http://islamicsupremecouncil.org/Condemnation/support/bin_ladens_nukes.htm
BIN LADEN'S
NUCLEAR WEAPONS
ex-Soviet Warheads Become Fuel for Portable Terrorist Nuclear Bombs
Arab-funded terrorists smuggle nuclear warheads, purchased from the
Russian mafia with opium and cash out of Russian territory, reaching
Khost overland via secret routes through Uzbekistan. There, former
Soviet scientists remove the active uranium to be processed and placed
in backpack-sized nuclear bombs—ready for transportation to the West
undetected—to explode in a blast of nuclear terror.
Al-Watan al-Arabi, an Arabic language newsmagazine, reports that
worldwide terrorist mastermind Usama bin Laden has used two tons of
opium and $30 million to purchase over twenty nuclear warheads. Bin
Laden has hired an international team of rogue nuclear scientists
working in a secret underground base to convert warheads stolen from
former Soviet republics into miniature portable nuclear devices capable
of striking targets around the globe.
The newsmagazine further states that bin Laden developed ties with the
mafias of former Soviet republics during the Afghan War which provided
him the key to obtaining nuclear missile warheads from the
disintegrating USSR.
The Arab Afghans, as bin Laden’s fighters are often called, have
established extensive bases and networks in many of the Central Asian
and Caucasian republics where, due to the weakness of the central
government and the minimal security, they are able to thrive
unhindered. These terrorist groups operate under the cloak of extremist
Islam claiming to oppose the local governments on religious grounds.
However, in addition to their calls for the overthrow of “corrupt
Islamic governments” these groups serve as a channel for bin Laden to
trade Afghani opium to the Russian mafia in exchange for stolen nuclear
warheads.
Al-Watan’s sources reveal that bin Laden recently sent a delegation
representing himself and the Afghani mafia to meet with the mafias of
the former Soviet republics. These mafia groups share a common
extremist ideology and have disguised their criminal activities under
the name of Islam. These mafias have terrorized the governments of the
newly-formed Central Asian republics intending to destroy them and
replace them with those following their fierce, extremist ideology.
This meeting of mafias was a prelude to bringing bin Laden out of
Afghanistan and into power in one of these Central Asian
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 256 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (11:28) * 2 lines
http://www.smh.com.au/news/0104/30/world/world8.html
http://www.msnbc.com/news/295108.asp
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 257 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (11:39) * 12 lines
I may have posted this before, but it's significant, this is what makes these attacks possible.
Osama Bin Laden is using web encryption - from
an article published months ago in USA Today
http://www.usatoday.com/life/cyber/tech/2001-02-05-binladen.htm
I hate to use the term, but Bin Laden and the terrorists are a global, virtual community, they don't have to be in one physical place to survive, they can disperse to the far corners of the earth and still maintain contact using 128 bit encryption. That's the scariest part of all this this, they are invisible to all our current monitoring technology. They are extremely difficult to pinpoint and attack.
This is what scares me the most about all this.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 258 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (11:39) * 3 lines
WASHINGTON — Hidden in the X-rated pictures on several pornographic Web sites and the posted comments on sports chat rooms may lie the encrypted blueprints of the next terrorist attack against the United States or its allies. It sounds farfetched, but U.S. officials and experts say it's the latest method of communication being used by Osama bin Laden and his associates to outfox law enforcement. Bin Laden, indicted in the bombing in 1998 of two U.S. embassies in East Africa, and others are hiding maps and photographs of terrorist targets and posting instructions for terrorist activities on sports chat rooms, pornographic bulletin boards and other Web sites, U.S. and foreign officials say.
from the above url
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 259 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (11:40) * 49 lines
"Uncrackable encryption is allowing terrorists — Hamas, Hezbollah, al-Qaida and others — to communicate about their criminal intentions without fear of outside intrusion," FBI Director Louis Freeh said last March during closed-door testimony on terrorism before a Senate panel. "They're thwarting the efforts of law enforcement to detect, prevent and investigate illegal activities."
A terrorist's tool
Once the exclusive domain of the National Security Agency, the super-secret U.S. agency responsible for developing and cracking electronic codes, encryption has become the everyday tool of Muslim extremists in Afghanistan, Albania, Britain, Kashmir, Kosovo, the Philippines, Syria, the USA, the West Bank and Gaza and Yemen, U.S. officials say.
It's become so fundamental to the operations of these groups that bin Laden and other Muslim extremists are teaching it at their camps in Afghanistan and Sudan, they add.
"There is a tendency out there to envision a stereotypical Muslim fighter standing with an AK-47 in barren Afghanistan," says Ben Venzke, director of special intelligence projects for iDEFENSE, a cyberintelligence and risk management company based in Fairfax, Va.
"But Hamas, Hezbollah and bin Laden's groups have very sophisticated, well-educated people. Their technical equipment is good, and they have the bright, young minds to operate them," he said.
U.S. officials say bin Laden's organization, al-Qaida, uses money from Muslim sympathizers to purchase computers from stores or by mail. Bin Laden's followers download easy-to-use encryption programs from the Web, officials say, and have used the programs to help plan or carry out three of their most recent plots:
Wadih El Hage, one of the suspects in the 1998 bombing of two U.S. embassies in East Africa, sent encrypted e-mails under various names, including "Norman" and "Abdus Sabbur," to "associates in al Qaida," according to the Oct. 25, 1998, U.S. indictment against him. Hage went on trial Monday in federal court in New York.
Khalil Deek, an alleged terrorist arrested in Pakistan in 1999, used encrypted computer files to plot bombings in Jordan at the turn of the millennium, U.S. officials say. Authorities found Deek's computer at his Peshawar, Pakistan, home and flew it to the National Security Agency in Fort Meade, Md. Mathematicians, using supercomputers, decoded the files, enabling the FBI to foil the plot.
Ramzi Yousef, the convicted mastermind of the World Trade Center bombing in 1993, used encrypted files to hide details of a plot to destroy 11 U.S. airliners. Philippines officials found the computer in Yousef's Manila apartment in 1995. U.S. officials broke the encryption and foiled the plot. Two of the files, FBI officials say, took more than a year to decrypt.
"All the Islamists and terrorist groups are now using the Internet to spread their messages," says Reuven Paz, academic director of the Institute for Counter-Terrorism, an independent Israeli think tank.
Messages in dots
U.S. officials and militant Muslim groups say terrorists began using encryption — which scrambles data and then hides the data in existing images — about five years ago.
But the groups recently increased its use after U.S. law enforcement authorities revealed they were tapping bin Laden's satellite telephone calls from his base in Afghanistan and tracking his activities.
"It's brilliant," says Ahmed Jabril, spokesman for the militant group Hezbollah in London. "Now it's possible to send a verse from the Koran, an appeal for charity and even a call for jihad and know it will not be seen by anyone hostile to our faith, like the Americans."
Extremist groups are not only using encryption to disguise their e-mails but their voices, too, Attorney General Janet Reno told a presidential panel on terrorism last year, headed by former CIA director John Deutsch. Encryption programs also can scramble telephone conversations when the phones are plugged into a computer.
"In the future, we may tap a conversation in which the terrorist discusses the location of a bomb soon to go off, but we will be unable to prevent the terrorist act when we cannot understand the conversation," Reno said.
Here's how it works: Each image, whether a picture or a map, is created by a series of dots. Inside the dots are a string of letters and numbers that computers read to create the image. A coded message or another image can be hidden in those letters and numbers.
They're hidden using free encryption Internet programs set up by privacy advocacy groups. The programs scramble the messages or pictures into existing images. The images can only be unlocked using a "private key," or code, selected by the recipient, experts add. Otherwise, they're impossible to see or read.
"You very well could have a photograph and image with the time and information of an attack sitting on your computer, and you would never know it," Venzke says. "It will look no different than a photograph exchanged between two friends or family members."
U.S. officials concede it's difficult to intercept, let alone find, encrypted messages and images on the Internet's estimated 28 billion images and 2 billion Web sites.
Even if they find it, the encrypted message or image is impossible to read without cracking the encryption's code. A senior Defense Department mathematician says cracking a code often requires lots of time and the use of a government supercomputer.
It's no wonder the FBI wants all encryption programs to file what amounts to a "master key" with a federal authority that would allow them, with a judge's permission, to decrypt a code in a case of national security. But civil liberties groups, which offer encryption programs on the Web to further privacy, have vowed to fight it.
Officials say the Internet has become the modern version of the "dead drop," a slang term describing the location where Cold War-era spies left maps, pictures and other information.
But unlike the "dead drop," the Internet, U.S. officials say, is proving to be a much more secure way to conduct clandestine warfare.
"Who ever thought that sending encrypted streams of data across the Internet could produce a map on the other end saying 'this is where your target is' or 'here's how to kill them'?" says Paul Beaver, spokesman for Jane's Defense Weekly in London, which reports on defense and cyberterrorism issues. "And who ever thought it could be done with near perfect security? The Internet has proven to be a boon for terrorists."
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 260 of 803: Charlotte (Charlotte) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (11:42) * 6 lines
"I can tell you that El Al maintains a high level of security for its passengers by not discussing its procedures in the media," he said.
HEAR, HEAR!
Am I alone in believing that far too much information is given to terrorists, criminals, enemies in the name of "freedom of speech"?
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 261 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (11:48) * 54 lines
And as a follow up to the above, from zdnet news
The hunt for suspects in Tuesday's terrorist attacks has moved online.
America Online has handed the FBI e-mail records for accounts belonging to the suspected hijackers, according to a report on CNN's Web site Thursday. AOL spokesman Andrew Weinstein declined to comment on any matters involving the investigation.
AOL Time Warner's online division stores logs of when instant messaging users are on the network; it also can access e-mail correspondence under certain situations.
"We are cooperating with (the FBI) in this ongoing investigation," Nicholas Graham, spokesman for Dulles, Va.-based AOL, said Wednesday. Although Graham wouldn't provide details, he denied reports that the company had agreed to install a Carnivore surveillance system. The FBI developed Carnivore, now renamed DCS1000, to allow it to wiretap communications that go through Internet service providers.
"We are able to provide them with information on an immediate basis," he said, stressing that such an ability made Carnivore unnecessary.
On Wednesday, EarthLink also acknowledged that it is working with the FBI to turn over specific information that may be relevant to the case.
EarthLink's vice president of communications, Dan Greenfield, confirmed that the Atlanta-based ISP was served with a warrant under the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) to turn over information.
FISA limits the ability of intelligence and law enforcement agencies--essentially the FBI, the CIA and the military information-gathering National Security Agency--from spying on the American public. The warrant covers investigations relating to the leakage of information to a foreign government and requires less burden of proof than a warrant in a criminal case. The directors of the FBI and the CIA as well as the secretaries of state and defense are the only government officials allowed to request a FISA warrant.
Calling the warrant "equivalent to a wiretap," Greenfield also denied that the company had let the FBI install a Carnivore system.
"We are not installing any equipment," he said. "We are cooperating with a very specific request. There are concerns from our customers that we are giving arbitrary access to our network, and we are not."
Most of the clues that have turned up so far in the hunt for suspects have been dug up through typical investigative footwork, not high-tech sleuthing.
Authorities are searching for the accomplices of a well-organized group of suicide hijackers who commandeered four commercial jets Tuesday, effectively turning them into flying bombs. Two flattened the World Trade Center, while a third seriously damaged the Pentagon. The fourth plane crashed in a field.
Some of the victims on hijacked aircraft used cell phones to describe the attacks to people on the ground. In addition, a review of the passenger lists has offered some leads.
So far, five Arab men have been identified by Massachusetts authorities as suspects, according to two Boston newspapers. Authorities have also seized a rental car containing Arabic-language flight-training manuals at the city's Logan International Airport, where two of the hijacked planes originated, the papers reported.
U.S. agents served warrants on homes and searched businesses in south Florida; they also issued alerts for two cars in connection with the attacks, local media reported.
Jack Mattera, director of computer forensics for The Intelligence Group, which specializes in corporate investigations and crisis management, stressed that information technology will likely play a crucial role in finding out who planned the suicide attacks.
"Using high-tech to investigate is critical," he said. "There are some things that gumshoe work is just not going to find."
Security experts described Tuesday's attack as low-tech, with reports of knives being used as the primary weapons in the hijackings. Nevertheless, many suspect computers and the Internet may have played a critical role in planning the complex and highly coordinated operation.
In February, George Tenet, the director of the CIA, warned members of the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence that terrorists were using the Internet and high-tech tools to communicate.
"International terrorist networks have used the explosion in information technology to advance their capabilities," he told the committee.
Mark Mansfield, spokesman for the CIA, declined to explain what tools the agency was bringing to bear, saying "it would be ill-advised for us to talk about (our methods). It would not be a prudent thing to do."
Both the NSA and the FBI declined comment as well.
However, The Intelligence Group's Mattera said he believed that the requests for online information may be to check out the people who posted suspicious information in public chat rooms or online.
"I think there is some indication that there may have been some information posted to different groups that didn't specifically alert people at the time, but now they may be able to go back and connect it to the suspects," he said.
"Two days ago, a (virulent) e-mail may not have meant anything," he said, "but today they will run it down and see if it's a clue."
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 262 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (11:51) * 49 lines
Gerard is still talking to us from on the ground in NYC.
Gerard Van der Leun (boswell) Fri Sep 14 '01 (08:37) 45 lines
Early this morning, looking out the window at the street,
I suddenly started to see in my mind a whole chain of
images from the last week. This was the first day when
I had nothing in front of me that I had to do, and
I just started to run the images... the rumble in my
building, the confused chatter on the radio, the
television images of the second plane coming in...
the street outside my house with dozens all running
toward the promenade to see the horro across the river..
the twin towers tall in the crisp and bright morning
with the flames and smoke streaming up like obscene
claws coming out of the building.
and the sound and the sight of the first tower just
going down and going down and the blast of dust up and
spewing out of the canyons of wall street and the
screams and wails around me as what we saw was so
far beyond our ability to comprehend the enormity of
it that we could have been just ants gazing at the
sole of a descending boot... and the sick wet
rumble that came across the water like a screaming
beast having its innards torn out
and the smoke, the immense plume of smoke that darkened
the sun and went on and still goes on...
and the rest of the day a dim numb blur
i had i think something to eat and i went to get coffee
in the bright sunlight with a friend
and i called my daughter and found she was safe
and far uptown, except of course she was not safe,
as none of our children will ever be safe again
until that thing that caused this is crushed and
killed and ground to dust and sent down into the
pit of oblivion forever.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 263 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (11:59) * 30 lines
Gerard Van der Leun (boswell) Fri Sep 14 '01 (08:43) 28 lines
and going back to my place and watching the endless
repeats and the endless parade of the doomed and the
wounded
and the hordes of people in the distance jamming the
bridge, the brooklyn bridge on which two large american
flags fly, these people all going one direction, one
direction only... out and away from the stench and
the terror and the death...
and somewhere in there the second tower came down
down on thousands trying to escape and down on hundreds
of what have to be the bravest and most noble souls
in the world, the fireman, the fireman who were going
up the stairs...
up the stairs...
UP THE STAIRS...
we cannot know what sort of human spirit that takes
we can never know... i have no humanity and no manhood
and no courage when compared to these men, none of
us do none of us...
do you all understand that they went into this building
and up the stairs?
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 264 of 803: Liz K (ekelley) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (11:59) * 1 lines
I am ready and willing to give up my civil liberties if it means that we can remain safe here in the US and the rest of the world. People need to realize that right now, and not complain about it, as they inevitably will.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 265 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (12:04) * 49 lines
Gerard Van der Leun (boswell) Fri Sep 14 '01 (08:56) 50 lines
and the day went on and went on... inside to television..
outside into the reality...
and the smell of it got stronger and the white ash of
concrete ash of steel ash of paper ash of human beings
drifted over me and everythingand everyone around me and
settled white and obscene on everything and the smoke
went on and the streets were filled with people whose
faces were filled with fear and with grief and with anger
and nobody spoke except to whisper to those next to them
that they knew or perhaps did not know but knew now
in this terrible day
at some point i began to take pictures of the skyline
which was not there any more, of the lives that weren't
there any more... of little things... but it wasn't
any use... it was pointless... feeling grief was
pointless... only rage seemed to have a point, rage
and hate, and it seemed important, very very important
to retain that rage and hate as a wall against the
pain and the despair...
i walked out again and again to look across the river
and to smell the smoke and to see the dust because
i knew that nothing would ever be the same again,
i knew that something had killed my world and the world
of those i loved... of the world of all of us...and that
no matter what we did that world would never be returned
to us... that we could and we must honor and remember it..
that we must take terrible and complete vengence on those
whose evil took it from us no matter what the cost...
but that world, that indian summer world, would not
be returned anymore than the lives of those who went
up the stairs in the burning and collapsing tower
would be returned.
this morning for the first time i have been weeping,
weeping not in tears but in a kind of dry low screaming
agony that sweeps up in my chest. it comes and
shakes me and then it goes away.
i'm going to go out into this world now to tend to
the little needs of my little day in my little world.
i can't bear to remember anymore of this week for now
even though I remember it all.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 266 of 803: Vera (kolin) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (12:41) * 2 lines
Over 100,000 people participated at the memorial service in Ottawa, with speeches by Jean Chretien, US ambassador Paul Celluci and Governor General Adrienne Clarkson.
Chretien expressed the resolve of Canada to fully supprt U.S at this difficult time.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 267 of 803: Evelyn (lafn) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (14:06) * 3 lines
Tony Blair's speech to the special session of Parliament was carried on FOX.
He also expressed the support and allegiance to the US in tracking down the terrorists by every means available.
Eloquent and sincere. Much appreciated.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 268 of 803: Moon Dreams (Moon) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (14:13) * 8 lines
Am I alone in believing that far too much information is given to terrorists, criminals, enemies in the name of "freedom of speech"?
You are walking a very thin line here. But I agree with you.
The thought of them having the possibility to make "backpack nuclear bombs" is a scary one. God bless us all!
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 269 of 803: Lucille Oftedahl (alyeska) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (14:33) * 5 lines
President Bush gave a very inspiring speech at the National Cathedral as did Billy Graham.
I was reduced to tears.
My friend Jean is still awaiting word of her sister who was at the WTC for a conference.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 270 of 803: Lucie (alyeska) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (14:33) * 1 lines
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 271 of 803: rachael (rachael) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (14:49) * 9 lines
we had a three minute silence and a candle-lit vigil at work today, at 11am, led by our chaplain. It was very moving and I'm glad I was there, although it feels such a small thing to do in the face of such enormity. Tony Blair said we (in the UK) stand shoulder to shoulder with the USA; NATO said an attack on one of us is an attack on all of us; we know now that this is true, that along with thousands of Americans were hundreds of British citizens, Irish, Canadians, Australians, and more, and this event will touch many of us, world wide.
My father, my uncle, and my grandfather were all firefighters. The loss of some of New York's finest is keenly felt in this home, many miles away.
I'm lucky, my friend escaped, my cousin's colleagues and friends are safe. My heart goes out to those not so lucky, and I just hope the prayers we said and the thoughts we had, at 11am this morning in the UK, go some way to comfort those shouldering terrible burdens.
I think I read somewhere that at 7pm tonight, US time, candles will be lit. 7pm in NYC is midnight here; I'll be lighting a candle then. Shoulder to shoulder; an attack on one of us is an attack on all of us.
God bless you
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 272 of 803: Eileen (EileenG) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (15:10) * 4 lines
(Mari) When I saw the new FAA "security procedures," I'd have laughed if it weren't so pathetic. No plastic knives, huh? Well, that's ok, since they never cut through the crummy food they give you anyway.;-) Seriously, this is *so* primitive!
B'ness as usual: 1. Panic. 2. Create specific reactive measures instead of broad proactive measures (golly gee, all 18+ hijackers answered the 'did you pack you own suitcase' question truthfully and they probably skipped curbside check-in). 3. Panic some more. Aargh! I was also LOL about the knives. Whatever will they do in first class, where the cutable food is served? Wait until someone chokes and sues. Or maybe they'll just ban airline food all together, or restrict it to the likes of those Otis Spunkmeyer cookies served by SouthWest. ;-)
Winter, by the time you leave for Indo the carry-on requirements might be better defined. You could also look into shipping some of those items ahead.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 273 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (15:24) * 93 lines
posted to a listserve
Dear Friends,
The following was sent to me by my friend Tamim Ansary. Tamim is an
Afghani-American writer. He is also one of the most brilliant people
I know in this life. When he writes, I read. When he talks, I listen.
Here is his take on Afghanistan and the whole mess we are in.
-Gary T.
Dear Gary and whoever else is on this email thread:
I've been hearing a lot of talk about "bombing Afghanistan back to the
Stone Age." Ronn Owens, on KGO Talk Radio today, allowed that this
would mean killing innocent people, people who had nothing to do with
this atrocity, but "we're at war, we have to accept collateral damage.
What else can we do?" Minutes later I heard some TV pundit discussing
whether we "have the belly to do what must be done."
And I thought about the issues being raised especially hard because I
am from Afghanistan, and even though I've lived here for 35 years I've
never lost track of what's going on there. So I want to tell anyone who
will listen how it all looks from where I'm standing.
I speak as one who hates the Taliban and Osama Bin Laden. There is no
doubt in my mind that these people were responsible for the atrocity in
New York. I agree that something must be done about those monsters.
But the Taliban and Ben Laden are not Afghanistan. They're not even
the government of Afghanistan. The Taliban are a cult of ignorant
psychotics who took over Afghanistan in 1997. Bin Laden is a political
criminal with a plan. When you think Taliban, think Nazis. When you
think Bin Laden, think Hitler. And when you think "the people of
Afghanistan" think "the Jews in the concentration camps." It's not
only that the Afghan people had nothing to do with this atrocity. They
were the first victims of the perpetrators. They would exult if someone
would come in there, take out the Taliban and clear out the rats nest
of international thugs holed up in their country.
Some say, why don't the Afghans rise up and overthrow the Taliban? The
answer is, they're starved, exhausted, hurt, incapacitated, suffering.
A few years ago, the United Nations estimated that there are 500,000
disabled orphans in Afghanistan--a country with no economy, no food.
There are millions of widows. And the Taliban has been burying these
widows alive in mass graves. The soil is littered with land mines, the
farms were all destroyed by the Soviets. These are a few of the
reasons why the Afghan people have not overthrown the Taliban.
We come now to the question of bombing Afghanistan back to the Stone
Age. Trouble is, that's been done. The Soviets took care of it
already. Make the Afghans suffer? They're already suffering. Level
their houses? Done. Turn their schools into piles of rubble? Done.
Eradicate their hospitals? Done. Destroy their infrastructure? Cut
them off from medicine and health care? Too late. Someone already did
all that.
New bombs would only stir the rubble of earlier bombs. Would they at
least get the Taliban? Not likely. In today's Afghanistan, only the
Taliban eat, only they have the means to move around. They'd slip
away and hide. Maybe the bombs would get some of those disabled
orphans, they don't move too fast, they don't even have wheelchairs.
But flying over Kabul and dropping bombs wouldn't really be a strike
against the criminals who did this horrific thing. Actually it would
only be making common cause with the Taliban--by raping once again the
people they've been raping all this time
So what else is there? What can be done, then? Let me now speak with
true fear and trembling. The only way to get Bin Laden is to go in
there with ground troops. When people speak of "having the belly to do
what needs to be done" they're thinking in terms of having the belly to
kill as many as needed. Having the belly to overcome any moral qualms
about killing innocent people. Let's pull our heads out of the sand.
What's actually on the table is Americans dying. And not just because
some Americans would die fighting their way through Afghanistan to Bin
Laden's hideout. It's much bigger than that folks. Because to get any
troops to Afghanistan, we'd have to go through Pakistan. Would they let
us? Not likely. The conquest of Pakistan would have to be first. Will
other Muslim nations just stand by? You see where I'm going. We're
flirting with a world war between Islam and the West.
And guess what: that's Bin Laden's program. That's exactly what he
wants. That's why he did this. Read his speeches and statements. It's
all right there. He really believes Islam would beat the west. It
might seem ridiculous, but he figures if he can polarize the world into
Islam and the West, he's got a billion soldiers. If the west wreaks a
holocaust in those lands, that's a billion people with nothing left to
lose, that's even better from Bin Laden's point of view. He's
probably wrong, in the end the west would win, whatever that would
mean, but the war would last for years and millions would die, not just
theirs but ours. Who has the belly for that? Bin Laden does. Anyone
else?
Tamim Ansary
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 274 of 803: Rebecca Carson (Becka) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (15:33) * 11 lines
Rachael -
My father, too, was one of the head Fire Chiefs in Toronto. Two of my uncles are currently Captains (it seems to run in families, doesn't it?)
I am totally devastated by the deaths of those brave men. My Dad is crushed, and he just had a cornea transplant which makes his pain even worse. My Dad had meet those chiefs who died in NYC on a couple of occassions at international events. If it had been here, in Toronto, I probably would have lost a few members of my family.
I am trying to help my Dad's department organize something here cause like many, I really want to help.
At the moment I have had to turn the TV off as they are putting faces on the dead, and it is breaking my heart.
Here in Canada 100,000 people showed up at Parliament Hill in Ottawa for a memorial ceremony - that is a huge number. I am so proud of Canadians, so proud for the world for sharing in this grief.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 275 of 803: Eileen (EileenG) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (15:43) * 1 lines
Had the TV on all morning, sobbing. Each story is more heartbreaking than the next.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 276 of 803: suzee (suzee202000) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (16:15) * 35 lines
Washington Post
New York Airport Suspects Cleared
By Donna De La Cruz
Associated Press Writer
Friday, Sept. 14, 2001; 11:12 a.m. EDT
NEW YORK –– About a dozen travelers of Middle Eastern descent who were detained at two New York airports have been cleared of any connection with this week's terrorist attacks, federal authorities said Friday.
One person, however, remained in custody, said Barry Mawn, head of the FBI's New York office. That person had not immediately been charged and may be released, Mawn said.
The incidents Thursday caused the region's three major airports – Kennedy, LaGuardia and Newark, N.J. – to close again just hours after service had been restored because of the attacks.
Authorities had been investigating whether the two groups – detained at Kennedy and LaGuardia – were more would-be hijackers or people related to the attack trying to flee the New York area.
Sen. Joseph Biden, chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, told CNN the arrests were based on suspicions that the men were linked to Tuesday's attacks on the World Trade Center and Pentagon.
One man was arrested because he was belligerent, while the others were merely detained and questioned, according to the senator's chief of staff, Alan Hoffman.
Biden said there were explanations for the suspicions. One man was originally thought to be traveling with a fake pilot's license. Biden said the man was a pilot who also had his brother's identification.
"His brother happened to live in an apartment complex that was one in Boston where some of these people had actually been," said Biden, D-Del.
Others were traveling to a Boeing Co. conference, either because they work for the airline manufacturer or were invited, Biden added.
"The folks at the airport thought, 'Hey, wait a minute, are they impersonating crew?' And they weren't."
Mawn said he could not verify reports that the individuals had been taken forcibly off a plane.
----------------------------
I saw an interview on Good Morning American. A passenger said the pilot - after
talking with those on board - told them to buckle up because they would soon be
taking off. About 20 minutes later, men with guns drawn, in full riot gear,
came in the rear and took the suspects away.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 277 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (16:21) * 3 lines
This is incredible stuff - world wide empathy and support feels very good, indeed.
Lest anyone mistake Rob's comments in Caps, I want to assure you that he is a very special friend; conservative, itelligent and thoughtful. He is not given to overstatement nor emotionalism. Emphasis is what those Caps were for, and, Rob, many warm thanks for your doing so.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 278 of 803: Evelyn (lafn) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (16:49) * 2 lines
Tamim Ansary. Tamim is an Afghani-American writer.
Wonder what this guy is doing to help his country except write emails?
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 279 of 803: suzee (suzee202000) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (16:55) * 35 lines
Washington Post
New York Airport Suspects Cleared
By Donna De La Cruz
Associated Press Writer
Friday, Sept. 14, 2001; 11:12 a.m. EDT
NEW YORK –– About a dozen travelers of Middle Eastern descent who were detained at two New York airports have been cleared of any connection with this week's terrorist attacks, federal authorities said Friday.
One person, however, remained in custody, said Barry Mawn, head of the FBI's New York office. That person had not immediately been charged and may be released, Mawn said.
The incidents Thursday caused the region's three major airports – Kennedy, LaGuardia and Newark, N.J. – to close again just hours after service had been restored because of the attacks.
Authorities had been investigating whether the two groups – detained at Kennedy and LaGuardia – were more would-be hijackers or people related to the attack trying to flee the New York area.
Sen. Joseph Biden, chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, told CNN the arrests were based on suspicions that the men were linked to Tuesday's attacks on the World Trade Center and Pentagon.
One man was arrested because he was belligerent, while the others were merely detained and questioned, according to the senator's chief of staff, Alan Hoffman.
Biden said there were explanations for the suspicions. One man was originally thought to be traveling with a fake pilot's license. Biden said the man was a pilot who also had his brother's identification.
"His brother happened to live in an apartment complex that was one in Boston where some of these people had actually been," said Biden, D-Del.
Others were traveling to a Boeing Co. conference, either because they work for the airline manufacturer or were invited, Biden added.
"The folks at the airport thought, 'Hey, wait a minute, are they impersonating crew?' And they weren't."
Mawn said he could not verify reports that the individuals had been taken forcibly off a plane.
----------------------------
I saw an interview on Good Morning American. A passenger said the pilot - after
talking with those on board - told them to buckle up because they would soon be
taking off. About 20 minutes later, men with guns drawn, in full riot gear,
came in the rear and took the suspects away.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 280 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (17:00) * 197 lines
Womack Diary, Day 3 *8-/
Subject: Day 3, and this morning
Date: Friday, September 14, 2001 9:10 AM
From: Womack, Jack
Our secretary Heather (who just moved here from Alaska, two weeks ago) and
myself are the only people on our floor so far this morning. Yesterday we
were essentially told the building would be open, but after that it was up
to us. And, as my ISP is down in the Closed Zone (I called them "control
zones,"), I can't do email from home (and so won't be writing again till
Monday), here I am, at least for a couple of hours.
This morning it's raining, very hard, a frog-strangler. I don't think it's
rained this hard this consistently all year. My pants are still wet and the
tie's soaked through. This has made rescue attempts pretty much impossible,
today, not that at this point anyone is really expecting survivors -- they
were saying on the news that the dust down there, wet, has the consistency
of oatmeal; and that with every half-inch of rain that falls, several
additional tons of weight begin pressing down on everything. The subways
down there have also all flooded, even before this, what with water main
breaks in evidently several locations (This water of course is also soaking
into foundations throughout the area). It's also turning much cooler --
somewhere in the 60s today, and yesterday afternoon it got up to the
mid-80s, I think, and was humid enough to notice.
It came to me this morning that the reason 30,000 body bags are on hand for
what appears will be 5,000 casualties is that the 5,000 are all in pieces,
and each piece of course will need to be bagged separately.
There was a drawing in the Daily News today showing the outlines of all the
buildings surrounding where the Trade Towers stood, and noting that at least
9 of them have suffered major structural damage. The Milennium (sic) Hotel
and 1 Liberty Plaza I mentioned yesterday. Among the others in bad shape is
one of my favorites, the 1927 Bell Telephone building at the corner of
Barclay & West. It stands next to both the North Tower and 7 WTC, both of
which collapsed. It's a Ferris-silhouette art deco beauty, and the building
is built over the sidewalk on the Barclay St. side, a stone arcade running
the length of the block. Cool in the summer.
It looks like the only residential area fully evacuated was Battery Park
City, where Ellie lives (she is still staying with patrick & Teresa, I am
hoping she's been able to get some sleep soon). No word on when that'll open
back up but I can't imagine it'll be anytime soon.
THis morning, coming out of the subway, I was maybe one of three or four
people. After yesterday, which at moments almost felt like a normal day (or,
rather, a day in the gone world), today seems much more like Wednesday did,
except far more grim due to the rain. As all of you know in the rain New
York's color goes, essentially, gray. Very gray. And that's how it looks
today. With luck, it will at least finally clear the dust out of the
atmosphere (it struck me yesterday that one of the many interesting things
we've all been breathing in the past few days are bits of infinitesimally
powdered glass). But if the other buildings start falling, the cloud will
come back.
In this sort of weather in the past, of course, the cloud cover overlying NY
would generally be so low as to hide the Trade Towers for view, and it was
pleasant to be able to fantasize, at such moments, what downtown NY used to
look like when they weren't there. I was reading, somewhere, that some
European is already saying that he & others will get all European nations to
help rebuild at least one of the towers if not both, bigger and taller and
clearly even more of a hideous target. Thank you Europe, but no, please.
Here are the ongoing bigger or more interesting changes in the event, both
onsite and in media, that I'm noticing. I talked about some of these last
night with Clute.
1. The first media memorial teddy bear site appeared. In Union Square, which
is right at 14th Street where the No-Traffic Zone begins. Some workmen
brought up a piece of steel from the Trade Towers and wrapped it around a
stele, or flagpole, or something -- they never pan up of course to show you
what the thing is, focusing instead on the flowers being left. The one good
thing is at this point, no teddy bears have appeared. It's mostly single
flowers and pictures of missing people, so I'm actually not sure that a
media-driven Mourning Zone will take hold. I suspect because everything in
New York is a Mourning Zone, and everyone here is too much in shock, still,
to even be thinking of those goddamned teddy bears.
2. The dawning awareness of New Yorkers, such as myself & Ellen Datlow (who
I met for a couple of drinks last night, down in Chelsea, as she was finally
able to get above 14th.), that this is actually being paid attention to out
in the country. A very funny thing, this -- the sense I think held to
varying lengths of time by people who live here that what has happened is in
some ways just the mother of all water main breaks. It's impossible for me
to really sense, that is, what the mood of a non-New Yorker living in the US
is just now, because even now I cannot see it from a non-New York
perspective. I always knew New Yorkers were the biggest provincials and this
just proves it...
3. Yesterday I walked from work (5th & 53rd) to meet Ellen at a restaurant
at 8th & 18th, down in Chelsea. On the way down I saw a large group of
people gathered around the front of a souvenir shop, and realized they were
going through the postcards buying any with the Trade Towers on them; saw
people standing out in front of hotels, clearly not flying out anywhere
again today; and on all the mailboxes, in telephone kiosks, on parked vans,
on walls, the more the further down I got, photocopied flyers with a photo
and a name and a number. We see dead people everywhere.
4. Anti-Arab action increasing, in Brooklyn, but still I think on a smaller
scale than what seems to be happening in Michigan and elsewhere. On the day
of the event the Uzbekhi guys' frame shop in my neighborhood & Samad's Deli
immediately closed. The poor guys were obviously terrified they were going
to be overrun -- like anyone at either place would ever have time to be a
terrorist; they're always at work. Most New Yorkers I think aren't buying
into this, however.
5. But we can always count on the reliable Richard Brookhiser, who in his NY
Observer column yesterday was baying for the nukes, and the Post as ever,
came through. From yesterday's editorial -- sic the James Ellroy-like use of
single sentences as paragraphs:
"The heavens need to fall on their heads.
They need to bleed.
Not next month. Not next week.
Now.
Who are they? Who cares?
Cast a wide enough net, and you'll catch the fish that need catching."
Clute actually didn't believe me at first when I read this aloud to him.
Notice how by the final sentence the author sounds exactly like an Arab
Terrorist Making Ominously Vague Statements Directed At The West. Like
attracts like, I suppose.
6. The Disaster Videos. The gang in the network editing rooms have had
enough time to put together Meaningful, Olympics-like Montages. Last night's
on NBC at 12 midnight was scored to Dylan -- I think it was Dylan, late
Dylan, now that his voice is indistinguishable from that of Joseph Spence --
singing "We Shall Overcome." Better than Celine Dion, I suppose, but the
worst instincts of the media are of course beginning to emerge. Paul McAuley
tells me of seeing of UK TV the same thing I saw, though done by different
broadcasters, i.e. as PM put it "two grinning journos demonstrated how easy
it is to use MicroSoft Flight Simulator to ram the Twin Towers. The street
finds its own use for technology...." Also, they're filling up the time with
human interest stories, i.e., talking to someone holding up one of the
aforementioned flyers and saying that they can't give up hope, and talking
to people who have given up hope. Terribly invasive in both instances.
7. A shrink, around 11:30 last night on ABC, was saying that it is
completely possible to get PTSD (post-traumatic stress disorder, no longer
"syndrome.") through constant watching of the event on TV. So not only will
I be living in a city in which nearly all the citizens, myself included,
will to some degree be effected by this for months or years, but a good
percentage of everybody else in the country, and the world, as well.
8. Probably in relation to the former, I am having a very hard time wanting
to know more about the ones they arrested at LaGuardia & Newark yesterday. I
haven't even begun to process the event. I hadn't really begun to process
the event of my stepmother's dying suddenly, last week. So no, I can't say
I'd want to hear *what else* may happen. The desire to extrapolate is,
suddenly, gone. Clute & I were talking yesterday about the limitations of
metaphor which this event will bring about (he'd better explain it, though).
9. I feel pretty sure that we're not going to be seeing many new big budget
blow-em-up movies at least for a while, and we will never view the ones that
have already come out, in the past, employing the same eyes again.
10. In relation to some degree with the former, the way in which,
periodically, scenes I am viewing in real life are reminiscent, or nearly
identical to familiar scenes in movies. One particular view of downtown last
night could have come straight out of Bladerunner, no problem; and a view
from midtown from the Empire State Building looking downtown, in a
sunset-filled orange cloud overhanging the city, looking almost exactly like
the old (Bantam, I think) cover of Walter Tevis' MOCKINGBIRD.
11. In relation probably to PTSD, however small-scale, I feel myself at
moments, for one of the few times in my life (the other being at certain
times in Russia, and at the Galleries Lafayette food hall in Paris) at
absolute sensory overload -- that if I know another sensation, just at that
moment, I'll become ill. At that point I leave the room, or change the
channel to something else. Forbidden Planet was on last night, and I much
enjoyed watching it. It was science-fiction not set on earth --
12. I'm not sure that Blinky, standing at his desk while expressing his
concern, is better than Blinky sitting at his desk, expressing his concern;
but I suppose his minders felt it gave him more of that Oprah feel.
And I think I've reached sensory overload, writing about it. So for now I'll
stop. More co-workers have come in, but it's still not a normal day by any
stretch. I figure I'll be leaving around noon, as before. Hard rain,
falling.
I'll actually leave the last word to Paul, who closed his letter to me today
with this; and I couldn't do better.
The Last Night of the Proms, the traditional end to the Promenade series of
concerts, traditionally finishes with a rousing queasily patriotic chorus of
'Land of Hope and Glory'. Not now: instead, Leonard Slatkin will be
conducting the orchestral setting of Barber's 'Adagio for Strings', which
thanks to Oliver Stone has become your plangent accompaniment to national
mourning, followed by the defiant thunder of the last movement of
Beethoven's Ninth.
They've judged it right.
Paul
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 281 of 803: Moon Dreams (Moon) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (17:08) * 5 lines
Evelyn, Tamsin is an Afghani-American who has been living here for 35. His country is America.
Thank you for posting Tamsin's letter.
We're flirting with a world war between Islam and the West.
My husband is Italian and he has been saying this for years, that it would happen. This is their holy war, this is just what they want. Americans and the international community believe they will be going to war to fight against terrorist, but they will be fighting the holy war.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 282 of 803: Cheryl (CherylB) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (17:26) * 5 lines
Marcia, I wasn't at all offended by Rob's use of capital letters. He only used them to emphasize one particular thought in his post. It is a time of high emotion and different people express themselves differently. As it is also a time of high stress, some may react to certain things more strongly than would be the norm. It would seem that no harm was meant either by Rob or those who had been put off by his use of upper case letters.
I've been able to contact my friends living in New York. Everyone is physically fine, but they say that they feel emotionally sick and bruised. So do I for that matter.
Lastly, the Pennsylvania crash site isn't all that near Pittsburgh. It lies about 80 miles to the southeast, near the Maryland border, about 35 miles SSW of Johnstown. Pittsburgh is the largest city near it, and more people have an idea of where Pittsburgh is than were Johnstown, PA is. The plane crashed in Somerset county which is a very rural area. It came down in a cornfield. Fortunately no one on the ground was hurt.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 283 of 803: Charlotte (Charlotte) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (17:37) * 1 lines
Last night one network (I forget which) reported that they had "found" 10 policemen on the 2nd underground level...one of them had reached his wife via cel phone. Has anyone heard more about this? Is it confirmed? I could find nothing about it on any of the other networks.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 284 of 803: suzee martin (suzee202000) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (18:03) * 49 lines
It was a hoax.
Friday September 14 11:36 AM ET
NY Mayor Asks Media for Accuracy
By DAVID BAUDER, AP Television Writer
NEW YORK (AP) - Mayor Rudolph Giuliani (news - web sites) asked the news media to be more careful reporting about the World Trade Center rescue operation Friday, saying wrong information is raising false hopes and endangering workers.
``Some of it can be very dangerous and emotionally damaging,'' he said.
He cited false reports that a potential survivor had been in contact with people by cell phone, and that 10 or 15 people were trapped alive in a store.
Media outlets reported Thursday that five firefighters trapped since Tuesday had been rescued from the trade center rubble. It later turned out that only two who were trapped in an air pocket for several hours Thursday were found alive.
Not only does false information play with the emotions of people with missing friends and relatives, it can send rescue workers on dangerous, fruitless chases, he said. He urged news organizations not to report such details until confirmed by police and FBI (news - web sites).
``If we could all be a little more patient and verify information before we put it out, we won't raise people's hopes unnecessarily,'' Giuliani said.
CNN anchorwoman Paula Zahn, responding on the air to Giuliani's request, noted that it has been difficult to get accurate information out of the rescue site.
``We're all trying to heed this advice,'' she said. ``Unfortunately, everybody is being given conflicting information.''
ABC, CBS, NBC and the cable networks were into their fourth day of exclusive devotion to the story on Friday. News executives say they're keeping in mind television's role as a national gathering place in times of emergency.
Network news chiefs uniformly expressed pride in how their profession has performed this week.
``There's really been a careful approach to the story that combines aggressiveness in getting information out with the awareness that we should not be speculating and we should not be alarming people,'' said CBS News President Andrew Heyward.
NBC is being careful in its wording to not equate Islam with extremism even if some of the religion's believers masterminded the attack, network news President Neal Shapiro said.
Until Giuliani announced Thursday that 4,763 people were missing at the World Trade Center, networks had generally been careful not to guess on the number of casualties. An exception: network reports that as many as 800 people died at the Pentagon; the estimate is now 190. There were also widely varying reports on the number of body bags brought to the World Trade Center site.
News organizations also made different decisions when confronted with video depicting victims jumping from the World Trade Center to certain deaths; CBS showed it, ABC refused.
``It was not some sort of gratuitous, individual tragedy where we were exploiting someone's personal pain for some kind of sensational purpose,'' Heyward said. ``Quite the opposite. This was absolutely germane to the context of the story and vividly conveyed the sheer horror in a way that was journalistically appropriate.''
Offered the same video, ``without any hesitation we turned it down,'' said ABC News President David Westin. ``I don't believe that showing actual human beings leaping to their deaths was helpful.''
CNN showed images of things falling from the World Trade Center, but they weren't necessarily identifiable as humans, CNN Chairman Walter Isaacson said. NBC showed footage of a body falling once and decided not to anymore. The same was true at Fox News Channel.
``I don't think it's an easy call,'' NBC's Shapiro said. ``I don't condemn anybody who chose to run it.''
At least two networks were planning specials to help children cope. Peter Jennings will anchor a one-hour ABC special for youngsters Saturday morning, and Nickelodeon will present ``Nick News: Kids, Terrorism and the American Spirit'' with Linda Ellerbee on Sunday night.
----------------------------------------
If someone who knows how would delete my double post, I would be grateful.
-- I think I hit reload and it sent all again - at least it shows on my computer.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 285 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (18:07) * 1 lines
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 286 of 803: Charlotte (Charlotte) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (18:18) * 1 lines
Thanks, Suzee. (I only saw one copy of your post, by the way.)
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 287 of 803: Wolf (wolf) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (19:27) * 7 lines
we are skating on thin ice in this topic by venting our anger here. this will not help anyone. the afghani-american writer above makes sense, IMMHO. the Holy War is what these people want. and they sure as heck are trying hard to get it too. it's all around us, look at Israel, look at the Serbs, look at Ireland, for goodness sakes. this is ridiculous.
ok, the service today was wonderful though i was a bit worried about all those people in the same place.
tonight at 7, please light a candle!! and if you've flown a flag today, thank you so much. my sub-division either didn't have the flags or were too afraid to show them but to those who did, thank you very much!!
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 288 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (21:00) * 3 lines
My candle is lit and sitting vigil at the base of my flagpole.. 7 PM was 1 PM here and it is broad day light. The candle will remain as long as it burns. The flag at half staff is coming down at sunset to rise then lower to half staff again tomorrow. Fighting amongst ourselves just plays into their hands. Come on world, we're better than that!!!
Terry, MSNBC ran the Bin Ladin interview this afternoon again. You sure you want to see this man?
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 289 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (21:04) * 14 lines
a new CNN article which explains how the Taliban are trying to defend
Bin Laden and turn this into a religious war:
http://www.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/asiapcf/central/09/14/afghan.denial/
_Prepare for Holy War_
"Now, the third empire of the world wants to impose an attack on us,"
[supreme Afghan leader Mullah Mohammed Omar] said. "As you know better,
it is not because of Osama [bin Laden]. This is the demonization of
Islam."
Well, this idiotic move does nothing more than confirm their role
as a Bin Laden conspirator.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 290 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (21:21) * 22 lines
...
To insistent chants of "U.S.A.! U.S.A.!" from the crowds of workers,
Mr. Bush took hold of a small bullhorn and climbed atop a small pile of
rubble. He then shouted over a chorus of cheers that he wanted the
rescuers to know that all America was deeply grateful for their
efforts.
"This nation stands with the good people of New York City, and New
Jersey and Connecticut, and we mourn the loss of thousands of our
citizens" he said.
To cries of "George, we cant hear you!" the President replied:
"I can hear you! I can hear you!"
"The rest of the world hears you," he added. "And the people who
knocked these buildings down will hear all of us soon!"
...
more at: http://www.nytimes.com/2001/09/14/national/15CND-BUSH.html
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 291 of 803: Wolf (wolf) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (21:36) * 3 lines
that was wonderful--the chanting and that he went straight in there...but because of the whole security issue where he is concerned, the operation slowed down. did anyone else get that impression?
yes, terry, The Holy War between the west and islam.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 292 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (21:44) * 8 lines
Please, just do not make a martyr of Osama Bin Ladin. I am pleased with how America is responding. Makes me all gritty determination mixed with misty patriotism. I will do without, I will do what is necessary. Just do it right!
Go to website and see the pics in all 4 sections.
Humbling, maddening, speechless...
This should never have happened.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/photo/attack/newyork/6.htm
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 293 of 803: Wolf (wolf) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (21:45) * 3 lines
that was wonderful--the chanting and that he went straight in there...but because of the whole security issue where he is concerned, the operation slowed down. did anyone else get that impression?
yes, terry, The Holy War between the west and islam.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 294 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (22:19) * 21 lines
No one's making a martyr of Bin Laden. He's dispicable.
They keep saying he's worth $300 million.
The Banks aren't very top notch in Afghanistan. Where's he keeping this money.
We should find out and confiscate all his money.
NBC is now reporting that a couple of guys with box cutters were arrested
off an Amtrak train in San Antonio, the cops thought they were drug dealers
because they had a lot of cash. Now they're thought to be major players in
this terrorist network.
It's been getting a lot of local attention, now it's starting to break
nationally.
US officials are in the Caymans investigating a letter warning about a major
terrorist act against the US involving airlines. It was treated as "merely
speculation" by the government (whose?, the Caymans?). Three men are being held in
the Cayman Islands.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 295 of 803: Moon Dreams (Moon) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (23:35) * 6 lines
This Cayman's connection sounds like that's where they might have a bank account. That should be investigated.
the Holy War is what these people want.
We are going back to the Crusades.
There has been a major influx of Muslims all over Europe and in some cases such as Rome, they insist on having a mosque built. I would like to see in which Muslim country one can go live at and insist they build a Catholic church. It would never happen.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 296 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Fri, Sep 14, 2001 (23:37) * 82 lines
Sebastian Mendler (smendler) Fri Sep 14 '01 (20:26) 83 lines
Subject: groping towards a solution (fwd)
Hi, friends --
Okay, let's see here... tell me if I am incorrect in any of the following
points, or in the reasoning that I am trying to distill from them.
1. Unless I remember wrongly, the Japanese were seen during WWII much the
same way as the Islamic Extremists are being seen now -- driven by
religious fervor, unable to be reasoned with for that reason, not afraid
to die for their cause.
2. This religious fervor was defused after the war by Hirohito shedding
his divine status, and a constitutional monarchy being established in
Japan.
3. The majority of Japanese had little or no problem making the
transition. This probably had something to do with the fact that the most
fervent believers in the old system were, well, dead.
4. The huge occupation force in Japan both respected many
traditional Japanese institutions, and defanged the more troublesome ones.
5. At the same time, the Americans in that force brought back to the US
awareness of many aspects of Japanese and Asian culture that had hitherto
been little-known in the US.
6. They also brought along some wives.
7. The Afghani people are in dire straits indeed -- so dire, some say,
that bombing them would be pointless, there's nothing worth bombing. The
resulting weakness is one reason why the Taliban have not been tossed out
on their turbans.
8. As the saying goes, you catch more flies with honey than with vinegar.
9. The point of the globalist movement -- which one assumes includes
Bush, Powell, et al. -- is that Our Way of Life is the best one, so we
need to get everybody involved in it. At least, that's sorta what they'll
tell you if you ask.
10. The Japanese, rebuilt, became an economic powerhouse, and a key
player in the world economy. It liked the results. The former militarist
viewpoint, while still maintained by a few bitter conservatives, lost its
former stranglehold on the soul of the nation.
11. So perhaps it makes more sense, not to try a purely military
operation, but rather to try more of a *cultural* invasion. Think of the
liberation of Pepperland from the Blue Meanies by the Beatles in _Yellow
Submarine_. Restore color, light, and music to a dark, silent, depressed
land. Wall-to-wall carpeting, not carpet bombings. PT Cruisers, not
cruise missiles. Water, not napalm. Perfume, not tear gas.
12. Such an operation would still have its military aspects, and they
would be huge. All the invading force of aid workers, fashion designers,
educators, doctors, chefs, musicians, jugglers, car dealers, etc. would
need to be protected while they did their jobs. Any attacking forces
would be squelched, stomped, eradicated; but in the absence of attacks,
life would get better and better for the folks that cooperated. This
force would be much more like a police force than an army. (Sometimes,
the best defense is to not be offensive.)
13. At the same time, we would not repeat the Soviets' mistake of trying
to eradicate the fundamentalists. Chase them into the hills, and let them
live their lives the way they want to. In fact, make sure they
do; protect them from *all* outside influences, and protect the outside
from theirs. Do not try to follow them into the mountains.
14. In this scenario, there would be plenty of opportunities for the more
bloodthirsty among us to kick some righteous butt -- the beachheads (so
to speak) will be tough to establish -- but these opportunities would
ultimately be in the service of the healers.
14. At the same time, there are transformations to be effected within the
Western world -- but maybe we should save that for another time...
Am I on a promising track here?
/ /skip
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 297 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (00:05) * 2 lines
Terry, Dear, you were not the one I thought might martyr this sick man and his followers. Unhappily we need give them no more reasons to hate Americans and want to kill them. His followers need little urging to create mayhem, it seems.
*HUGS* (despicable is the nicest thing I have heard him called all week!)
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 298 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (00:07) * 3 lines
Bin Laudin is an ex-Saudi. He just about holds the ruling house ther hostage for letting us land jets in Saudi Arabia during the gulf war.
I am certain Swiss accounts are numerous, too.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 299 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (00:14) * 2 lines
Oh Skip, if only it were that simple. We are discussing a belief system here not a political one. Too many serf in both instances. How long do you think the dress designers would last in a land and religion which hides their women and treats them as chattel (not to mention mutillation, so I won't mention it.)
Our do-gooders would be deader then doornails as soon as they landed. This is an other world. They are not insular, this cell system of radical Islamists! They infiltrate every layer of society and in OUR country of dress desingers, and still loathe us enough to kill us in cold blood - civilians!!! Think some more... I'm listening!
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 300 of 803: Beth (Bethanne) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (00:26) * 5 lines
Well seeing as Bin Laden is as good as he is, at keeping his movements and his intentions hidden, I doubt if hiding $300 million in a series of international bank accounts, would be all that hard for him.
If it is stashed away in Swiss bank accounts, I'm not holding my breath that it can be found and confiscated any time soon. How long did it take for the Swiss banking authorities to finally cooperate, in tracking down loot stolen by the Nazi's....45, 50 years ?
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 301 of 803: Moon Dreams (Moon) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (00:37) * 5 lines
The Japanese, rebuilt, became an economic powerhouse, and a key
player in the world economy.
This was the way that the Brigate Rosse terrorists in Italy where defeated as well. And did you know that Baywatch is the number 1 TV show in Iran?
Unfortunately, the world has not acted on this before and now things have gone too far. Their Muslim radical power works on the poor because religion thrives in poor countries. The Jihad has started. I only pray that no atomic bombs will be used from either side.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 302 of 803: Moon Dreams (Moon) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (00:38) * 2 lines
If it is stashed away in Swiss bank accounts, I'm not holding my breath that it can be found and confiscated any time soon.
It is different now. There no longer is secrecy in Swiss banking.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 303 of 803: Beth (Bethanne) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (01:26) * 6 lines
ROTFLMAO Moon.....Baywatch is the Number 1 rated program in Iran ? Are you serious ? Yikes, I bet the late Ayatollah Khomeni is just thrilled to bits, not to mention David Hasslehoff....LOL
Thanks for that Moon, I needed a good laugh after this weeks trauma.
By the way, what are #2 and #3 Three's Company and Charlie's Angels ?
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 304 of 803: Annette Mercer (laughingsky) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (09:28) * 1 lines
I have never experienced such a massive show of patriotism as I have in the last few days. Last week, I admit that I would have passed many American flags with my thoughts absorbed in something else, never really and truly acknowledging the stars and stripes and for what that flag stands for. Somehow, in times past, the word "patriotism" has always rattled a little nerve in the "government-is-out-to-get-us" leftist side of me. Today, though, I am beginning to look at that flag and the word "patriotism" in a different light. Don't get me wrong - I'll still be looking over my shoulder, but, I am feeling a great sense of togetherness with this "patriotism" attitude. It is only saddening to realize what it has taken to get me to this place.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 305 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (09:42) * 23 lines
http://pain.outloud.org/gary/thankyou/
These are photos from around the world of people stopping and praying,
lighting candles, etc. big page but worth the wait time. There's a photo
of Arafat giving blood. And this link is to a Yahoo! "slide show" of 20+
photos of newspaper front pages from around the world after the attack.
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?p=news&g=events/ts/091201newspapers&e=1&tmpl=sl&nosum=0&large=0?tamp=1000366704",610,580);
This was an attack on the world trade center and it was an attack
on the world, that building housed so many nationalities and religious
types, I'd like to see a breakdown.
BBC morning news reports that Pakistan is not going to allow an assault
from bases in their country, we'll have to stage from India? Or Dushanbe?
The Russians may be advising us on how to invade Afghanistan, do you see
the irony in this? We're going to need a multi-faceting approach with not
only air strikes but covert activity and ground troops. And at the same
tiem we're going to have to bolster our homeland defense, unlike the Gulf
War where there were only air strikes and no danger at home.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 306 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (10:18) * 36 lines
Pakistan won't allow flights originating from their land but
they'll most likely allow flyovers. The European
community may offer some support but not likely
overwhelming, though I'm comforted by Tony Blair's
statements and actions, they've been courageous.
Russia and India will be our staunchest allies. Need a
million or so soldiers? India has 'em and would probably
put them out on to the battlefield. An alliance with
Russia will minimize China overnight. I just hope I'm
wrong about lukewarm Euro participation.
This is the first war of this century in a millenium that
started out looking like it would belong to China and
Asia. Now that balance may be changing and it will become
the century of global, English speaking democracies lead
by America, India, Canada, UK, Australia, and New
Zealand. This may have the effect of changing the balance
of power for a century to come.
We're lost the symbol of our Western global economy, but
in the processed it's galvanized the global English
speaking democracies in a way we would never have done
spontaneously.
Think about this in your little cave, Osama.
Think about a wealthy, technologically advanced, English
speaking India ruling the region. Think about about a
total global power change that will transform tragedy in
to a brighter future for all mankind.
India and Russia may need this kind of power boost from
the US, they're struggling and they need to be galvanized
and energized in the direction of becoming sane,
technologically advanced democracies.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 307 of 803: Karen (KarenR) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (11:04) * 1 lines
"English" is not the tie that binds when it comes to India's involvement.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 308 of 803: Moon Dreams (Moon) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (11:16) * 1 lines
Tha Russians did rather poorly in Afghanistan and I doubt that India would would be heavily involved. I would like to see what those tradionally "leftist" European countries do.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 309 of 803: Toyce (toyce) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (11:17) * 1 lines
As for the lukewarm European leaders' response, didn't they learn from the 1930's that appeasement did not change any outcome?
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 310 of 803: Toyce (toyce) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (11:18) * 1 lines
Karen is right. If India joins this, it will probably be for Hindu revenge against the Muslims.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 311 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (11:51) * 207 lines
FBI Press Response
September 14, 2001
Washington D.C.
FBI National Press Office
The following is a list of the nineteen (19) individuals who have been
identified as hijackers aboard the four airliners that crashed on
September
11, 2001, into the North and South Towers of the World Trade Center in
New
York, the Pentagon, and Stony Creek Township, Pennsylvania. Information
listed for each hijacker differs, but may include date of birth, address
provided, or visa status. This is the extent of the information available
at
this time.
The FBI requests that anyone who may have information about these
individuals-even though they are presumed to be dead- to immediately
contact
an FBI filed office or call the toll-free hotline at 1-866-483-5137.
American Airlines #77
Boeing 757
8:10 am departed Washington Dulles for Los Angeles
9:39 am crashed into the Pentagon
1) Khalid Al-Midhar - Possible residence (s) : San Diego, California and
New
York, New York; Visa Status: B-1 Visa, but B-2 Visa had expired.
2) Majed Moqed - No information available.
3) Nawaq Alhamzi - Possible residence (s) : Fort Lee, New Jersey and
Wayne,
New Jersey and San Diego, California.
4) Salem Alhamzi - Possible residence (s) : Fort Lee, New Jersey, and
Wayne,
New Jersey.
5) Hani Hanjour - Possible residence (s) : Phoenix, Arizona and San
Diego,
California. Believed to be a pilot.
American Airlines #11
Boeing 767
7:45 am departed Boston for Los Angeles
8:45 am crashed into North Tower of the World Trade Center
1) Satam Al Suqami - Date of birth used: June 28, 1976; Last known
address:
United Arab Emirates.
2) Waleed M. Alshehri - Dates of birth used: September 13, 1974/January
1,
1976/ March 3, 1976/ July 8, 1977/ December 20, 1978/ May 11, 1979/
November
5, 1979; Possible residence (s) : Hollywood, Florida/ Orlando, Florida/
Daytona Beach, Florida; Believed to be a pilot.
3) Wail Alshehri - Date of birth used: July 31, 1973; Possible residence
(s)
4) Mohamed Atta - Date of birth used: September 1, 1968; Possible
residence
(s) : Hollywood, Florida/ Coral Springs, Florida/ Hamburg,
Germany; Believed
to be a pilot.
5) Abdulaziz Alomari - Date of birth used: December 24, 1972 and May 28,
1979; Possible residence: Hollywood, Florida; Believed to be a pilot.
United Airlines #175
Boeing 767
7:58 am departed Boston for Los Angeles
9:05 am crashed into South Tower of the World Trade Center
1) Marwan Al-Shehhi - Date of birth used: May 9, 1978; Possible
residence:
Hollywood, Florida; Visa Status: B-2 Visa; Believed to be a pilot.
2) Fayez Ahmed - Possible residence: Delray Beach, Florida.
3) Ahmed Alghamdi - Possible residence: Delray Beach, Florida.
4) Hamza Alghamdi - Possible residence: Delray Beach, Florida.
5) Mohald Alshehri - Possible residence: Delray Beach, Florida.
United Airlines #93
Boeing 757
8:01 am departed Newark, New Jersey, for San Francisco
10:10 am crashed in Stony Creek Township, Pennsylvania
1) Saeed Alghamdi - Possible residence: Delray Beach, Florida.
2) Ahmed Alhaznawi - Date of birth used: October 11, 1980; Possible
residence: Delray Beach, Florida.
3) Ahmed Alnami - Possible residence: Delray Beach, Florida.
4) Ziad Jarrahi - Believed to be a pilot.
Topic 14 [attack]: Events of Sept 11, 2001
#54 of 65: Bruce Sterling (bruces) Fri Sep 14 '01 (21:26) 85 lines
*Every Time I Hear "A New Era for Humanity" Announced,
I Really Have to Wonder If It Can Last Even Six Months *8-/
Subject: Yann Moix: A New Era for Humanity
Date: Friday, September 14, 2001 11:52 AM
From: Patrice Riemens
Reply-To: Patrice Riemens
To:
A New Era for Humanity
by Yann Moix
Liberation (Paris), September 14, 2001
original in French at
http://www.liberation.com/ny2001/actu/20010914venze.html
Bingo, folks! The World will never go at war again, and yet it will be
at war always, period. War and non-war, there shall be no difference any
more. From the 11th of September 2001, all will be war, even peace.
Peace shall no longer be the opposite of war, but its context, its
natural environment, its ecosystem, its scene, its background, its
screen-saver. War and peace shall no longer be each others contraries
(that was in the good old manichean East vs West times), but they shall
be imbricated the one in the other, like the two connected faces of the
same reality. Peace shall be a kind of specific sub-case of war. War
shall henceforth be everywhere and nowhere. War shall be waged in the
dustbins of the Paris railtermini, war shall be waged above our heads in
the air of the metropolises. War shall be permanent. War shall be open
for business 24/24, 7/7 , just like CNN. There shall be intermissions,
but no reprieve. It shall be a war blind, yet precise, fuzzy, yet
targeted. Because never before has the distortion been so stark between
fuziness of the causes and the acuurateness of the strikes.
The First HyperWorldWar has started. It is a war where all pretenses
will fly, and where acts will be used as statements of purpose
afterwards. Let's call this a hyperwar: a world where the ordinary,
natural context of societies is no longer peace, but war. A hyperwar is
not a classic world war with opposite fighting sides. It is a
'non-Euclydian', non-catalogised war, without rules and principles
others than its own logic. Hyperwar cannot be localised in space. Nor in
time. It is a kind of magnum opus of terrorism,its _best of_ or rather
its _worst of_: plane hijacks, crashes, bombs, kamikaze operations.
In fact it was the 20th century as a whole that was fast-forwarded in
just a couple of minutes on the 11th of September, 2001. And that will
be the birth certificate of the 21st Century, like (the 31st of July)
1914 was it for the 20th. But it are no longer states which are waging
war, but wars that are making states. But then, unheard of sort of
states: non-nation-states, states without teritorry, without citizens or
borders, without (elected) governements, nay, these are virtual states,
scattered war-states, fuzzy, networked octopus-states, community-states
whose only borders are ideological. These states, just like virusses,
evolve, adjust, mutate, invent and reinvent themselves everyday.
Sometimes, their size is reduced to that of a lone individual who is an
ideology, an army, a clear and present danger all unto himself. And a
walking bomb. After the era of the statesmen comes the era of the
state-men. The political state has become undistinguishable from the
biological state.
Over these past days, we have been bombarded with the metaphor of Pearl
Harbour: nothing could be further from the truth. Pearl Harbour was an
episode within a war. The 11th of september was the definition of an
other type of war, the starting point for a new era in human history.
The human element is now being affected all over the planet, since
hyperwars feeds itself on the psychoses it creates by the permanent
menace it exerts on all. Psychosis has become the continuation of war by
other means. It gnaws at the individual, it eats up her/his mind, it
shatters her/his rational structure. It is a war on the 'may be/ may be
not' mode, whereby the horror is mainly a potential one. And thus, it is
a war that may have a beginning, but no end. Hyperwar is built for the
long run. It thrives in totality, that of the universe and of eternity.
(Halelujah! - tr -)
(Q&D translation by yours truly)
Reposted without permission whatsoever
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Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 312 of 803: Moon Dreams (Moon) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (11:52) * 5 lines
The Tamil Tigers in India have caused thousands of deaths because of terrorist attacks.
As you see this is truly a Holy War.
Those "leftist" European Countries have lost their religion and have become homocentric. There is -0 population growth because young couples even if they bother to get married are not interested in having children. They prefer the material to the spiritual. It will be interesting to see what kind of allegiance those countries give the US.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 313 of 803: Toyce Southern (toyce) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (11:57) * 1 lines
Just heard Netenyahu (sp?) on Fox. He made a good point. The reporter tried to make a comparison between the communists and the terriorists with regard to nuclear weapons. He said that was incorrect. He said the communists put their lives above their ideology. These people put their ideology above their lives.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 314 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (12:13) * 84 lines
A chronology of strikes by Laden on US interests
NEERAJ SAXENA
TIMES OF INDIA NEWS NETWORK
NEW DELHI: A glance at the chronology of terrorist attacks made on the US in
the past one decade would indicate that the destiny of the US and its one-
time bete noire Osama bin Laden have almost become inextricable.
If the US is to be believed, almost all the attacks have been carried out or
aided by bin Laden. However, the US has been harsh with its usual suspect
just once. The missile attacks on his safe haven in Afghanistan and Sudanese
factory was the only time when the US displayed its military might in
retaliation.
In 1996, former President Bill Clinton had even signed a secret order that
authorised the CIA to use any and all means to destroy Laden's network, but
the world's most powerful state has not been able to ensure this.
In August, 1996, a secret grand jury investigation began against bin Laden
in New York. He was quick to sign and issue a declaration of jihad on August
23 against the US and UAE, outlining his organisation's goals.
CHRONOLOGY OF EVENTS
December 29, 1992: A bomb exploded in a hotel in Aden, Yemen, where the US
troops had been staying while en route to a humanitarian mission in Somalia
against guerilla leader Muhammed Aidid. The blast killed two Austrian
tourists as the US soldiers had already left.
RESPONSE: Two Yemeni Muslim militants, trained in Afghanistan and injured in
the blast, arrested later. US intelligence agencies said this was the first
terrorist attack involving bin Laden.
February 26, 1993: A car bomb went off in the basement parking of the now
fallen World Trade Centre, killing six people and injuring over 1,000.
RESPONSE: Six accused, including the mastermind and confidante of Laden --
Ramzi Yousef -- sentenced to 240 years in prison for the bombing, for
plotting to destroy WTC, the UN headquarters and to plant bombs on airliners
flying out of the east coast. Ramzi was extradited from Pakistan and had
close links with Laden according to the US.
October 3, 1993: Eighteen US troops killed in a guerilla attack in
Mogadishu, Somalia. American law enforcement, intelligence and national
security officials are divided as to whether, as a Federal indictment
charges, bin Laden and his associates trained and armed Somalia warlord
Aidid's men.
RESPONSE: Over 300 rebels claimed to have been killed by the US Rangers.
April 19, 1995: A US government establishment in Oklahoma city bombed by an
explosives laden truck parked in the car park of Alfred P Murrah building,
killing 168 people, and wounding over 500.
RESPONSE: Initially, the US suspected Osama bin Laden to be behind the
bombing, but a 27-year-old misguided youth Timothy McVeigh was captured
later, convicted and later executed. A key witness Terry Nichols sentenced
for life.
November 13, 1995: Five Americans and two Indians killed in the truck
bombing of a US-operated Saudi National Guard training center in Riyadh.
RESPONSE: The US accuses bin Laden. He denies involvement, but praises the
attack.
June 25, 1996: A large truck bomb devastates the US military residence in
Dhahran called Khobar Towers, killing 19 servicemen.
RESPONSE: The US military initially Laden had a hand in the attack, but now
believes that a Saudi Shiite group was responsible. But US investigators
still believe Bin Laden was somehow involved.
August 7, 1998: US embassies in Kenya and Tanzania bombed by a suicide
bomber, killing over 230 people and leaving over 4,500 injured.
RESPONSE: US retaliates swiftly on August 20 by firing 70-80 `Tomahawk'
Cruise missiles at alleged terrorist training camps in Khost, Afghanistan
and the Al-Shifa pharmaceutical plant in Khartoum, Sudan saying it was a
chemical weapons factory. Several of Osama Bin Laden's alleged co-
conspirators put behind bars in the US.
October 12, 2000: A small dinghy laden with explosives rammed into US
warship USS Cole in Aden Harbour, Yemen, killing 17 US sailors and injuring
39 others.
RESPONSE: Besides blaming Laden, the US has not done much by the way of a
retaliation so far.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 315 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (12:19) * 5 lines
335 newspaper front pages -- 189 from the
day after the attack and 146 extra editions published on the day of the
hijackings.
http://www.poynter.org/index.cfm
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 316 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (13:06) * 20 lines
On the topic of bin Laden's money, Forbes has some info:
http://www.forbes.com/2001/09/14/0914ladenmoney.html
Highlights:
Although bin Laden's been kicked out of Saudi Arabia and his
citizenship revoked, much of his money is 'tied up in businesses' in
Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates. He also has access to
'charitable foundations,' not named, that are 'unregulated and
untaxed.'
Following a description of the abject poverty of Afghanistan, it talks
about how bin Laden and other expatriate Saudis live there and pay 'a
lot of rent.' You can afford a private army for $35,000 a month as you
don't have to pay people much.
Money is transferred from country to country via an informal network
called "Hundi," basically just individuals transferring money among
themselves. Very difficult to track.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 317 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (15:07) * 4 lines
We could probably solve the airline hijack issue with the installation of an "auto lander" which could over ride the pilots and land the plane if it deviated off course and the pilots did not respond with a password or other test. The airline doors need to be strengthened and pilots shouldn't be able to open them during flight, and anyone on the passenger side of the door or doors (two or three makes more sense) would absolutely be unable to penetrate them. The problem is solvable.
But there are so many other unsolved procedures we need to put in place for so many as yet undreamed of scenarios.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 318 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (15:21) * 41 lines
From http://www.janes.com,
a global security website, has issued a list of the places that are known to
have involvement with Al-Qaeda, bin Laden's organization
Algeria
Egypt,
Morocco
Turkey
Jordan
Tajikistan
Uzbekistan
Syria
Xinjiang in China
Pakistan
Bangladesh
Malaysia
Myanmar
Indonesia
Mindanao in the Philippines
Lebanon
Iraq
Saudi Arabia
Kuwait
Bahrain
Yemen,
Libya
Tunisia
Bosnia
Kosovo
Chechnya
Dagestan
Kashmir
Sudan,
Somalia
Kenya
Tanzania
Azerbaijan
Eritrea
Uganda
Ethiopia
The West Bank and Gaza.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 319 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (16:32) * 1 lines
Correct me if I am under a misconception, but do we not worship the same GOD ultimately? How can they call it a Holy War and worship God? I have a copy of the Q'ran and it says nothing of the kind they are espousing. It is an excuse for greed and warped minds in which to find reason for their vengeance.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 320 of 803: Wolf (wolf) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (17:16) * 10 lines
it is just like anything else, cultish behavior brainwashing persons wishing to belong to anything.
islam is a peaceful religion. i was told that the women wear the abayaah to protect themselves from being leered at by men. when they are home, the abayaah is removed. much like the latino community, arabians are family oriented and often house extended families. at no time did i feel like i was a piece of garbage while in Kuwait. the stares that i received were because i am different from what they are used to seeing. men and women of all walks live and work there. these people are just like us, have the same concerns as we do. i witnessed one father rewarding his child for a job well done at school.
so please, do not assume that the arabian community is strange and should be feared. there are radicals in all communities, look at the guy in montana, he was american! look at the KKK, hello, people!
sadly, there are scams out there to get your money all in the name of this tragedy. do not give to these telemarketers because there is no campaign to gain donations this way.
something interesting: the taliban first mumbled that this was terrible, then pleaded that we do not bomb this poor country, then threatening surrounding neighbors that if they support the U.S., they will be attacked by holy warriors.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 321 of 803: Moon Dreams (Moon) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (19:48) * 7 lines
but do we not worship the same GOD ultimately?
You must go back to the Crusades, Marcia to get your answer.
i was told that the women wear the abayaah to protect themselves from being leered at by men.
Women are barely seen in the streets. They are second class citizens if at all.
A western woman respectfully travelling in those countries (as I have found myslf on occassion), better not get the urge to go to the bathroom outside their hotel.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 322 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (19:53) * 41 lines
The assassination of Massoud was no coincidence. It was most likely a signature attack by Bin Laden to eliminate Afghanistan's greatest anti-Taliban fighter. He was killed by explosives hidden in a belt or camera the day before the WTC attack.
http://www.nytimes.com/2001/09/15/international/asia/15MASS.html
http://frontierpost.com.pk/main.asp?id=8&date1=9/15/2001
I'm unclear if Pakistan will or will not allow us to use their country as a staging area. If someone hears about this will they post it here?
GERMAN OFFICIALS have asked the FBI and the
Securities and Exchange Commission to look into whether bin
Laden’s associates may have “sold short” stock in a Munich,
Germany, company that holds secondary insurance on the
World Trade Center.
http://www.msnbc.com/news/629380.asp
The stock market will open at 9:30 pm EST on Monday.
Biggest losers: airline stocks
Biggest winners: military, cellular, security, tech stocks
Other big losers: insurance stocks, hotels
Other winners: teleconferencing systems, construction companies,
fractional aircraft.
Ramzi Yusef, architect of first World Trade Center bombing, carried plans
for airliner suicide crashes:
http://www.worldtribune.com/wta/Archive-2001/me_terrorism_09_13.html
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 323 of 803: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (19:54) * 1 lines
I slipped with Moon.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 324 of 803: Wolf (wolf) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (21:17) * 11 lines
in case there is any confusion, i was told by a kuwaiti man why the women wear an abaayah. yes, there are countries in which arabian women are treated as third-class citizens. but, it was witnessed by me, women were treated with respect, no walking 6-ft behind the man or anything. they drove, ran businesses, walked with their similarily clad men, wearing gold jewelry, etc. i can only relay what i saw in kuwait. these men wait until they are well into their 30's before marrying in order to prove that they are worthy of a wife, to care for her financially and whatever children they have.
one arabian man said it clearly, the Koran (sp?) condemns behavior such as this. the muslim community needs to stand up to bin laden and use the word to show him as being wrong. several islamic people were interviewed and again reiterated that the Koran doesn't suggest anything of this nature. in fact, the Koran refers to all religions, christianity and judaism, not as being infidels, but as those included in the book, and infidels being those who do not believe at all (athiests).
bin laden may see this as a holy war, but, it is not, because the religion he proclaims to be an interpretor of, would not allow this. again, it's based on perception.
another thing i find interesting is that all the time, we are referred to as the devil, evil, etc. isn't that what we're doing? the deed was evil but we cannot condemn a whole peoples because of that. yes, i believe the guilty should and will pay.
and so, i pray that the countries vowing support and our country do not do anything irrationally. that we think through whatever our actions may be. yes, we are angry, that is a step in grief, but let us take our time and move through this. anyway, who am i to say anything.....
i think this discussion is healthy. *HUGS* to all!!!
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 325 of 803: Wolf (wolf) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (21:22) * 1 lines
oh yeah, this may be the least of their worries right now, but....has anyone started piling up the mass of paper that flew out of the WTC? i wonder if any of the accounts and such could be put back together with what was left of that? and, how come the paper didn't incinerate?
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 326 of 803: Beth (Bethanne) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (22:34) * 7 lines
Totally changing the subject for a sec.....I saw on CNN yesterday that the major US airlines lost $300 million per day, when they were grounded for 3 days. I am puzzled by this. I can understand why they may lose money in future, from a drop off in bookings.
But surely every person who booked a flight from Sep 11-13, would have paid for it in advance. Who here of us, goes some where with out having booked and paid for it weeks, if not months in advance ? So wouldn't the airlines have the money from all those grounded flights, already in the bank ?
I can see where they would lose money from the refunds they gave some people. But news reports showed most people waiting the delay out and not getting refunds. So where did this $300 million loss come from ?
Sorry if I sound mercenary and trivial. I am the daughter of an airline man, so I suppose curiosity about them, is in my blood.
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 327 of 803: Marcia (MarciaH) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (23:11) * 1 lines
Hugs to both Wolfie and Moon. You are both right. I just talked to a close friend who is Lebanese Muslim. She says depending on your sect, the rules vary as does status in the community make for variations. You also don't show the soles of your feet and you do not eat with your right hand....they do not shake hands - you wipe off human waste with that hand... and on and on. We need no acrimony....we are dealing with people who do not even understand each other!
Topic 55 of 99 [Geo]: Jumbo Jets crash in to World Trade Center
Response 328 of 803: LouiseJ (LouiseJ) * Sat, Sep 15, 2001 (23:13) * 2 lines
The losses were not from this week's flights. The airlines have already received most of the money for this week's tickets. But they also sell tickets on a daily basis for next week, next month, next year, etc. Apparently they would have sold $300M worth of these tickets per day. Because of the crisis, they could not, because they did not know when, or if, they would be able to fly again. Even now that flights have resumed, they apparently anticipate a substantial reduction in the number of tickets sold, due to fear of flying, longer delays at airports due to security, etc. From now on, it's going to be an uphill battle to sell tickets to people who don't "need" to fly. This is why they expect to lose a lot of money. They still have the same number of planes to pay for, airport lease facilities to pay for, etc. So--the same fixed expenditures going out with much less in ticket sales coming in. The only "flexible" spending they have in the short run is employees, so they have to lay people off. And
t
